from J. S. Marwick, praying that his service in Natal be taken into consideration in the calculation of his pension.

Referred to the Select Committee on Pensions.

asked if it were the Minister’s intention to move that the papers be considered by that House?

replied that the intention was to move for their consideration and ratification by the House.

Statement of accounts South African Railways and Harbours, 1st April, 1911, to 31st March, 1912, and Assistant Controller and Auditor-General’s report thereon, with memorandum by Controller and Auditor-General.

Return showing average number of children enrolled in State or State-aided schools in each of the Provinces during each of the last five years, distinguishing between Europeans and others; expenditure in respect of education, other than higher education, etc.

List of members of Board of Land and Agricultural Bank of South Africa, and list of persons appointed to staff of bank.

Rules relating to dispatch of business Griqualand West Local Division of Supreme Court of South Africa.

Finance accounts, appropriation accounts, loan funds and miscellaneous funds of the Union (exclusive of railways and harbours), financial year 1911-12, with report of Controller and Auditor-General thereon.

said that it was with the deepest regret that he had to say a few words in regard to the departure of a man whose name would be written in large letters in the history of South Africa. He was referring to the decease of Sir Gordon Sprigg. Sir Gordon Sprigg had come to South Africa as a young man— he thought he was 28 years of age when he arrived here—and he took his seat in Parliament for the first time in the year 1869. These were days, he (General Botha) thought which very few of the members of this House could remember, and, as a matter of fact, he thought there were not more than three men in this House who could remember these days. Sir Gordon Sprigg (the Prime Minister continued) had served this country in various capacities since that time, with only short intervals. He had been Prime Minister four times, and on various occasions he had been a member of the Executive Council. Until a very old age, he had devoted his life to serving the country which he had adopted as his home. One would realise, if one looked at the great age at which he departed from this life, that he had not spent his years in working for himself, but in working for the country and his people, because he died a poor man. He had rendered service to South Africa, not in his own interest, but in the interest of the people, through the love which he had for that people. Everyone in South Africa, but more especially in the Cape, where he was better known, acknowledged the services rendered by Sir Gordon Sprigg. One could say truly that when the question of taking away the Cape Constitution came up many years ago, he had been the corner-stone of the opposition to such a step being taken. Everyone in South Africa appreciated still the services rendered by Sir Gordon Sprigg, and when the historian wrote the history of this country, the part taken by Sir Gordon Sprigg would occupy an important place. He had contributed much to the civilisation and advancement of this country in order to make it a better place for the habitation of white people, and he (the Prime Minister) was sure that he spoke on behalf of the whole of South Africa when he expressed regret at his demise and sympathy with his relatives. His work was esteemed, and would long continue to exist. General Botha concluded by moving: That this House having learned with deep regret of the death of the Right Hon. Sir Gordon Sprigg, P.C., G.C.M.G., resolves specially, as a tribute to his memory, to place on record its recognition and appreciation not only of his varied and important public services during many years as an honoured Minister of His Majesty in the late Colony of the Cape of Good Hope, and a most distinguished ornament of the House of Assembly of the late Cape Parliament, but also of his high qualities as a generous and courteous gentleman; and, further, that the House, at its rising today, adjourn until Thursday, the 6th instant, at 2 p.m.

said he rose to second the resolution which had been so feelingly proposed by his right hon. friend, and so sympathetically received by all sections of the House. Although the Union Parliament, owing to his advanced age, had not had the benefit of the ripe Parliamentary experience of Sir Gordon Sprigg, there were many of them in that House who had personal recollections of the great services which he rendered to the Cape Parliament and indirectly to South Africa. (Hear, hear.) One of the greatest tributes which could be rendered to the Parliamentary services of a statesman like Sir Gordon Sprigg was the fact Í that the Union Parliament had adopted the procedure of the Cape Parliament, as a tribute to the Parliamentary records which passed away when Union was adopted. He (Sir Thomas) had the honour of serving under two Administrations presided over by Sir Gordon Sprigg, and though at a critical period in the history of this country he felt himself compelled to differ materially from the policy adopted by Sir Gordon, that difference of opinion never made the slightest difference in the personal friendship that had existed between them—(hear, hear)—an example which could be well laid to mind by all public men in this country. (Hear, hear.) Because if there was one thing more than another that tended to the advantage of our Parliamentary and public life it was the fact that they could differ materially in opinion without in any way interfering with their private relations, and that was always the attitude adopted by Sir Gordon Sprigg. As the Prime Minister had said, Sir Gordon Sprigg was four times Prime Minister of the Cape, which was a proof of the influence which he exerted, the respect which was accorded him, and the manner in which he assisted in moulding the destinies of the country. There were few remaining now of the old Parliamentarians, and Sir Gordon, he felt assured, had gone to his rest with an unblemished reputation and a record of great services performed for his adopted country. (Hear, hear.)

said he felt perhaps that it would not be out of place if he said a few words. (Hear, hear.) It was now just 44 years ago since he recollected embarking on a steamer at Port Elizabeth to come down with Sir Gordon Sprigg to their first session of Parliament. It was a long while ago, and much water had run under the mill since then. We lived now in another world. It was difficult to recollect the struggles that we had in those days. From the very time he entered Parliament, Sir Gordon Sprigg created a great impression. He had an intimate knowledge of the procedure of Parliament. He was a good speaker, and he took what we do not always take—a great deal of pains with his speeches, and made a great impression. In those days the great struggle was, of course, on the Responsible Government question. “Sir Gordon Sprigg,” continued Mr. Merriman, “ was an ardent supporter of Responsible Government; personally I belonged, perhaps, to the Brahminical caste, and was an opponent in those days. But not the less did I admire the way in which he fought for his own hand. There was, of course, at that time a movement on the part of the British Government to take away the troops from here and try to force Responsible Government on the country. Many of us resisted that, with success. Sir Gordpn Sprigg said the sooner the troops went and Responsible Government came the better, and his constituents differed from him on that account, unfortunately he had to remain out of Parliament for a short while. When Responsible Government came he and I came together over the crude attempt in the time of Lord Carnarvon to force federation on this country. We worked together and fought that battle together. Afterwards we separated again, and for many years I was a consistent opponent of Sir Gordon Sprigg. But that never made any difference at all to our friendly relations, when he was out of office or I happened to be out of office. I have received many kindly acts from him, and I hope I reciprocated to some extent. I fully endorse everything said by previous speakers with regard to the part Sir Gordon Sprigg played in building up Parliamentary government in this country. He was above everything a Parliamentarian; he loved Parliament, and he set us a good example, for I do not suppose a more sedulous man ever sat in any House.” Proceeding, Mr. Merriman said Sir Gordon Sprigg, down to extreme old age, sat through many nights in the House. He remembered one of the last of the all-night sittings in the old Cape Parliament, when Sir Gordon Sprigg, notwithstanding his extreme old age, could not be induced to go home, but remained at his post. He set an example to all of them in the dignity and courtesy with which he conducted debates, and the attention he paid to every member, whether young or old, and whether he was holding a responsible position or whether he was the humblest member of the House. In every case he was always polite and attentive. He was a good swordsman. He was not, perhaps, a brilliant speaker, but he was a sound speaker, and in his best days a very effective speaker, and he always had a hold and a mastery over his audience.

He showed a good example in another respect—he was a poor man, and he was never ashamed of being a poor man. There was no attempt at trying to appear what he was not. He was always proud of an honourable poverty. He loved the constitution, and he fought for the constitution, and at a critical period in the history of this country we owed a great deal to his efforts in securing and maintaining the constitution of this country, when, in a hurry, with the best possible motives, a great many people thought it would be better for this country to be placed temporarily under a despotism. He (Sir Gordon) hated a despotism; he was a Parliamentary man before anything. He did not think there was anything Sir Gordon was more proud of than being descended from one of Cromwell’s chaplains. Ho was a thorough Puritan and an independent, a good foundation for a Parliament man. Few of them could have wished to have seen him stretched out any longer on the Track of this cruel world. They had all seen with melancholy feelings his failing health and his failing powers. Nothing is so evanescent as the reputation gained in the Parliamentary field. We are soon forgotten. The hungry generations tread us down. He thought that as long as this Parliament remained here the name of Gordon Sprigg would be recollected as being one of those who had a great share in building up our Parliamentary traditions in this country. He wished there was some means of commemorating his services here. He wished it were possible for them to vote, a sum of money to procure a likeness of him to be put in Parliament House. He thought it would be a fitting thing to do. (Hear, hear.) He thanked those who came before him, who had not known him as long as he had— fortunately in this case, for they were much younger—and he felt that in paying this tribute to his memory by suspending the business of this House they would be doing nothing but what was fitting to commemorate a great South African. (Hear, hear.)

The motion was agreed to in silence, members rising in their places.

said he would undertake to forward a copy of the resolution to the members of the right hon. gentleman’s family.

asked the Prime Minister whether, in view of the fact that the Government owns a sixty per cent. interest in the Premier Diamond Mine, the Government will take steps to establish a cutting and polishing factory in Pretoria for the purpose, in the first instance, of cutting the Government portion of output of the said mine, and ultimately of cutting and polishing the whole of the diamond production of the Union in South Africa?

There are practical difficulties in the way of separating portions of the output of a diamond mine before disposal, which render it impossible to deal with a part of the Premier output, as suggested by the hon. member. Any steps which may be taken with regard to the establishment of an economically successful diamond cutting industry must be on general lines, and must keep in view the general economic conditions of South Africa, apart from the interest which the Government may hold in the proceeds of any particular mine.

asked the Minister of Justice: (1) Whether the attention of the Government has been drawn to the reports in the press to the effect that two members of the Police Force ejected a gentleman named Vere Stent from a public meeting held in Pretoria on Monday, the 20th instant; and if so, whether he is able to state on whose instructions the police acted and whether they did not exceed their authority; and (2) if the Government is not in possession of the facts, whether an inquiry will be instituted into the matter?

replied: As it is understood the matter is sub judice, I regret not being able to give a reply to the hon. member at this stage.

asked the Minister of Lands whether he intends to place on the Estimates for the coming year a sum for the purchase of a sufficient number of waterbores, in order that the many waterless Government farms may soon be available for purposes of settlement under the existing Act?

During the next financial year it is proposed to allocate 28 drills for boring operations on waterless Crown farms, which is twice the number actually so employed during the current financial year, and considerable progress is now being made with the opening up of new areas for settlement. In order to meet the demand for the hire of Government drills from farmers under the regulations, provision is being made on the Supplementary Estimates for the purchase of twelve additional drills, the necessity for which has only been clearly demonstrated since the Ordinary Estimates were prepared.

asked the Minister of Lands: (1) How much has been expended on surveys for irrigation works in the Transvaal since 1903; and (2) how much has been actually expended on building such irrigation works during the above period?

The information asked for by the hon. member involves a very considerable amount of labour, and will be furnished to him as soon as available.

asked the Minister of Lands whether the Government intends to make a commencement during the present year with an extensive and thorough irrigation scheme, in order to place on the land, and thereby to save from further ruin, a number of poor though deserving whites, who are resident within the Union and have experience in agriculture ?

The Government have under consideration several moderate-sized irrigation schemes suitable for the settlement of poor though deserving whites of different grades, and as fast as these schemes mature they will be laid before Parliament. A considerable amount of detailed work remains, however, to be done before Parliament can be asked to vote money for these projects.

asked the Minister of the Interior: (1) Whether he is aware: (a) That on Tuesday, January 7, an urgent telegram was sent to Pretoria, through the Magistrate’s Office at Kimberley, asking for arrangements to be made for the admission to a lunatic asylum of a European female insane patient; (b) that on Wednesday, January 8, a further telegram was sent from Kimberley, in which the relatives asked that, if possible, the patient might be admitted to the Bloemfontein Asylum; (c) that no reply was received until Friday, January 10, when further particulars were asked for, which were at once supplied; and (d) that on Monday, January 13, a telegram was sent from Pretoria raising difficulties about admission to the Bloemfontein Asylum, but making no suggestion as to any other arrangement: and (2) whether, in view of the serious delay which occurred in this case, and having regard to the paramount importance of the immediate admission of insane patients to a properly-equipped asylum, he will cause such arrangements to be made in future as to enable insane patients to be at once placed under proper treatment?

The facts are: On the receipt of the first telegram from the Resident Magistrate, Kimberley, which arrived after office hours on the 7th January, asking for the admission of a non-violent lunatic to an asylum, preferably Bloemfontein, the Medical Superintendent of the Bloemfontein Asylum was asked on the 8th January by telegram if he had room, and he at once replied that he had no vacant single room, and could only admit a quiet patient suitable for a dormitory. The Magistrate of Kimberley was thereupon telegraphed to on the 9th idem for particulars of the patient’s state. He replied on the morning of the 10th that the patient was quiet, and he was then informed by telegram the same day (not the 13th) that if the patient was being dealt with under the Cape Act admission to Bloemfontein Asylum could only be authorised after a Judge’s order had been obtained, and a warrant issued in accordance with section fifty-one of the Free State Act; but if it was inconvenient to institute proceedings under the Cape Act then the relatives could take her to Bloemfontein and have her certified and admitted under the Free State Act without delay. This ended the correspondence as far as this Department was concerned, and no further communication was received from Kimberley until noon of the 13th, intimating that the patient died on the 11th January.

No one, more than myself, regrets that the Union is so badly equipped with asylum accommodation as to make it impossible to admit all lunacy cases immediately the symptoms are diagnosed or suspected; for I am fully aware of the desirability of early treatment of all mental cases in a properly maintained asylum or mental hospital; and for the relations of the unfortunate lady whose case gave rise to this question I have the deepest sympathy.

In regard to the question of an extension of our asylums I would ask the honourable member to await reply, which will be given this afternoon to Question 33 on the same subject.

I would like to add that the most strenuous efforts are taken, in face of great difficulties caused by lack of accommodation and the long distances which have to be travelled before asylums can be reached, to administer the Lunacy Laws in an efficient manner, and I ask that the honourable member who asked this question would have been well advised had he in this case seen me and ascertained the real facts before giving notice of his question, which appears to me to have been based on a very garbled account of what actually transpired.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether he will state approximately the date of completion of the Benoni-Welgedacht Rail way?

It is hoped that it will be possible to complete the Benoni-Welgedacht line about August or September next.

asked the Minister of Mines how many of the applicants for Miners’ Phthisis compensation have received the grants in lump sums; how many have been refused lump sums, and what were the general grounds for such refusal?

Up to the 31st December, 1912, 427 applicants for compensation under the Miners’ Phthisis Act, 1912, received lump sums, and 889 received monthly allowances. Of the latter 196 have definitely applied for lump sum grants under section 19, and these have yet to be considered. The reasons for the majority of the awards having been made in monthly payments are: (1) That the Act contemplates payments being made in that manner, except in special cases, and (2) that in the majority of cases the Board after full investigation of the circumstances was of opinion that payment in lump sums was not justifiable, and that the circumstances of the particular application would be best met by awards in the form of monthly payments.

asked the Minister of Mines: (1) Whether the Government is aware that the output of the Premier diamond mine is now dealt with by an exclusive financial syndicate or trust in London, which controls also the output of De Beers and Jagersfontein mines; (2) whether the Government, in view of the State ownership of three-fifths of the Premier mine, will take steps to secure an entirely independent and separate valuation of diamonds, and, if not, whether it is content to accept the valuation made for the company and to allow the London diamond buying syndicate or trust to handle the entire output on the basis of such valuation?

(1) The output of the Premier diamond mine is at present sold through the company’s own representatives independently of the syndicate referred to by the hon. member. (2) I may add that if at any time the financial syndicate referred to were to be likely to control the disposal of the output of the Premier mine, and if it should become necessary to do so, the Government would take measures to protect its interest in the sale of the Premier output against any adverse combination.

They have power under the law.

Yes.

asked the Minister of Lands whether the Government intends to apply the provisions of the Land Settlement Act, 1912, to the land in the islands of the Orange River, at Keimoes and Friersdale, between Upington and Kakamas; and, if so, when?

It is proposed, so soon as circumstances admit thereof, to consult the Land Board concerned, with a view of ascertaining if the land referred to by the hon. member is suitable for disposal in terms of the Land Settlement Act, 1912. I would, however, point out to the hon. member that some delay may occur as the Government is desirous of first having a thorough survey and investigation made of this island and mainland along the Orange River between Upington and Kakamas. Very little is known at present about the areas fit for cultivation and irrigation, and it is hoped that by utilising power from the Great Falls a comprehensive irrigation scheme will be feasible. Survey operations will be commenced by the Irrigation Department early next financial year.

asked the Minister of Education what is the number of trained teachers in each Province who hold first class British or Colonial teachers’ certificates, and to how many of these in each Province will the First Class Certificates required under the Union Government be given on the qualification they already possess?

A notice is being published in the “Government Gazette” inviting applications for the award of Union Teachers’ First Class Certificates, in terms of the regulations. These applications will require careful consideration on their merits. It must be borne in mind that there is great diversity in the values of the certificates issued by the different Departments of Education in Great Britain and the Colonies. It is therefore impossible to supply at this time the information asked for.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether his attention has been drawn to the fact that at Philippolis-road Station, where there is a large amount of passenger traffic, which is daily increasing, no platform accommodation has been provided for the travelling public, who suffer great inconvenience in consequence, and, if so, whether he will take steps to remedy this state of affairs without delay?

Facilities at Philippolis-road are similar to those provided at many stations of equal and even greater importance, and at Philippolis-road passengers have advantage of entraining and detraining in daylight, whereas at several stations without platforms, passengers have to board and alight from trains during night. Traffic is increasing, but expenditure involved in providing platform accommodation at this station is not justified at present.

asked the Minister of Native Affairs whether he is aware that great dissatisfaction is being caused in the Transvaal, and particularly in the electoral division of Middelburg, by the squatting and congregating of natives in places other than those appointed for them by the Government, and if so, whether he will forthwith give instructions that the provisions of the Squatters Law No. 21 of 1895, Transvaal, which are still in operation, shall be strictly enforced?

replied: Since the date of Union complaints have been received because of the difficulty experienced in obtaining native labourers. The Native Commissioner has reported that there are many farmers without sufficient labourers, and has recommended that the Squatters Law should be enforced on several farms on which numbers of natives reside. The Native Commissioner has been asked to furnish full particulars concerning these farms, but the information has not yet been supplied. No new settlement of natives on any private property in contravention of the law is allowed. There are legal difficulties which stand in the way of the general enforcement of the Squatters Law. Since May, 1909, complaints have been received concerning the conditions prevailing upon twenty-eight farms in the district, and in nearly all of these cases the Government decided to apply the law, the removal of about 1,100 native families being involved, and as far as can be, effect will be given to the provisions of the law.

asked the Minister of Justice whether he is aware that the abolition of the Inquest Law by the late Transvaal Government has given rise to serious dissatisfaction in the Transvaal, and has tended to the miscarriage of justice; and whether it is the intention of the Government to introduce at an early date an Inquest Law for the Union?

replied: I am aware that dissatisfaction has been expressed with regard to the existing Inquest Law in the Transvaal. In 1901, Lord Kitchener issued Proclamation No. 10 of 1901 by which the practice previously obtaining in the Transvaal was altered and the following practice introduced: When a dead body was found of any person who died suddenly or was found dead or was suspected to have died otherwise than from natural causes within six miles of a magistrate’s office, the magistrate was required to proceed in person to the spot where the dead body lay to inspect it and hold an inquest thereon and examine witnesses to ascertain the cause of the death. He also was required to have the dead body examined by a medical man, or failing such, by the best qualified person who could be obtained. He was required to take evidence in writing, and if he came to the conclusion that, the deceased person came by his death in any way which involved a crime or offence on the part of any person, he had to have such person apprehended; in all cases he was required to send the papers on to the Attorney-General. Where the corpse was found more than six miles from the magistrate’s office, a justice of the peace was required to make the preliminary inquiry, on which the magistrate could, if he deemed it necessary, hold the further inquest. Complaints were received as to the cumbersome and expensive method introduced by the Proclamation of 1901, and I find that the late Attorney-General of the Transvaal also consulted the Mining Regulations Commission, and elicited from that body the opinion that the introduction of the system set up by the Proclamation of 1901 was not in the best interests of justice and was foreign to the laws of the Transvaal. They recommended a reversion to the system in vogue before the war, namely, that of leaving the investigation of all cases of accidental death in the hands of the police, the district surgeon, and the public prosecutor of the district. The Transvaal Parliament subsequently in 1909, by Act No. 8 of that year, repealed the Proclamation of 1901, and substituted the new inquest procedure, which still obtains, and which consists in casting a duty on any individual who finds a dead body of a person who appears to have come by his death by violence, or otherwise than from natural causes, or to whom the knowledge of any such death comes or to whom any such death is reported, to notify it, together with all facts known to him, to the nearest Police Station or Police Post, or to a Field-Cornet or to a Justice of the Peace. The two latter officials transmit the information received to the nearest police station. No person other than a medical practitioner is permitted to remove, stir, or touch the dead body so found until the body has been viewed by a policeman. The duty is then thrown on the policeman, who receives notice or hears of any such death, to enquire into the circumstances and causes of the death, to transmit a report in writing, verified by affidavit, to the Public Prosecutor and to state the facts found by him, and any conclusion at which he has arrived upon those facts, and to annex to the report any documents relative to the matter which are in his possession. The Public Prosecutor may then cause the dead body to be examined by a medical practitioner, wherever possible the District Surgeon. In addition to this procedure the Magistrate must, whenever directed so to do by the Attorney-General, hold a public enquiry into the circumstances and causes of the death and report thereon to the Attorney-General. Further, an enquiry by an Inspector of Mines or an Inspector of Machinery as to mining or machinery accidents causing death is considered to be a sufficient examination for the purposes of the Inquests Act unless the Attorney-General otherwise directs. Full powers are given to the Magistrate or Inspector to call witnesses, to put them on oath, to demand the production of documents, implements, weapons, and other articles. The three senior Magistrates of Johannesburg favour the present system as compared with the system which obtained under the Proclamation of 1901. The police authorities concur and are not aware of a single case of any miscarriage of justice having resulted from the present practice, which agrees with what obtained in the Transvaal before the war. As regards the other Provinces of the Union, the provisions of Cape Act No. 22 of 1875 and the Orange Free State Proclamation No. 14 of 1901 are the same as those of the repealed Transvaal Proclamation No. 10 of 1901. In Natal, by Act No. 10 of 1897. coroners may be appointed to boroughs and sit at such places as the Town Council determines. There is, however, in Natal no law which specifically provides for inquests in rural areas; the police investigate the cause of sudden deaths under suspicious circumstances.

said that he would like to have a reply to the second part of his question.

Yes. I have no information upon that. (Laughter.)

asked the Minister of Lands whether in view of the large number of applicants who were approved by the Transvaal Land Board, but who received no cattle when the first distribution took place, as also in view of the satisfactory results of the system followed in the Transvaal from 1908 to 1910, it is not possible to commence again with distributing cattle among poor Europeans?

No provision has been made in the draft Estimates for the ensuing year for continuing the policy referred to by the hon. member, but it is proposed to submit during this session a Bill dealing further with the question of the settlement of indigents on the land.

asked the Minister of Justice: (1) Who was responsible for the reduction in fees payable to expert witnesses in the Lower and Higher Criminal Courts; (2) what were the reasons for these reductions; and (3) whether, in view of the injustice involved and the dissatisfaction created, he intends either to revert to the former scale of fees or to fix a revised scale?

replied: The Government was responsible for the change from the Transvaal Tariff of £2 2s. per diem for expert evidence in criminal cases to £1 1s. per diem in the Tariff for the Union. The reason of the change was that it was considered undesirable to discriminate between evidence given by professional men generally and that given for expert purposes, or between one approved profession and another, as had been done in certain of the Provinces, the principle of the Union tariff for all classes being that loss of time is not compensated for, only out-of-pocket expenses being paid, professional men, however, suffering no reduction although resident at the seat of the Court. The consolidation of the Tariff has been considered since 1910, and in 1912 was submitted to a Conference of Registrars and Taxing Officers of the Superior Courts held at Pretoria last year. The regulations give the power of favourably considering any case of exceptional hardship. It is not proposed to re-consider the general basis until the new Tariff has stood the test of a longer trial than it has had so far.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether, in view of the unsatisfactory arrangement in regard to the conveyance by rail of Europeans and coloured persons, he will forthwith give instructions to make adequate provision for separate carriage accommodation for both races on the railways?

replied that the department recognised that it was essential, as soon as possible, to construct special railway carriages for coloured people. The hon. member was aware of the resolution to that effect passed by Parliament last year. On some suburban lines there were three carriages specially for coloured people, and many more carriages were in course of construction. It would naturally take some time before these carriages were ready. At the present time, £200,000 was being spent to give effect to the resolution of Parliament, and to put this matter into full effect, an expenditure of £400,000 in all would be necessary. On the lines where it was most necessary, the carriages which were ready were being placed.

asked the Prime Minister: (1) Whether any communication has taken place between the Union and Imperial authorities on the subject of placing the services of the Imperial Consular officers throughout the world at the disposal of representatives or citizens of the Union on similar lines to those arranged between Canada and Great Britain; (2) if so, what is the nature of such communication; and (3) if no such communication has taken place, whether, in the interests of the. Union, he will endeavour to open negotiations on the subject?

A communication of the nature indicated by the hon. member has recently been received from the Imperial Government, and is now under the consideration of the Union Government.

asked the Minister of Native Affairs whether, in view of the unsatisfactory state of affairs prevailing in the mission station at Zoar, in the district of Ladismith, the Government is prepared to take steps under the existing laws governing mission stations for the election of a proper committee, and, if so, when?

replied: The Government has given the fullest consideration to the question of the application of the Mission Stations Act, 1909, to Zoar, and the establishment of a Board of Management to control local affairs, and repeated investigations have been made by the Magistrate of Ladismith. It is realised that affairs in this station are not satisfactory. The relations between the people and the Missionary Society are not all that could be desired, and it has been reported that strangers are improperly admitted, that squatting is condoned, and that the people generally are deteriorating. The consent of the Dutch Reformed Church has been obtained for the Act to be applied, but the difficulty is that there is unanimous opposition on the part of the inhabitants to any change being affected. The Government is not inclined to force the measure on the people under existing circumstances, as to do so would inevitably result in a deadlock. But it is hoped that it will be practicable to bring them to a realisation of the advantages of the system of local government provided for in the Act.

asked the Minister of Posts and Telegraphs whether he is aware of the unsatisfactory condition of the post office at Heilbron, by reason of an insufficient staff, in consequence of which the public suffer much inconvenience; and, if so, whether he will institute an inquiry with a view to improving this state of affairs?

The staff circumstances at Heilbron are receiving consideration. Arrangements will shortly be made whereby the circulation of telegrams for other centres through the office at Heilbron will be very considerably reduced, and this will free the staff for other duties and thus minimise any public inconvenience which may at present be felt.

asked the Minister of Posts and Telegraphs: (1) Whether it has been brought to his notice that some months ago the post office at Bultfontein, district Hoopstad, Orange Free State, was closed for three days, to the great inconvenience of the public, because the postmaster, who is at the same time telegraphist, was unable through serious indisposition to do his work, and had no assistant or other clerk to relieve him; and (2) whether he is prepared to take the necessary steps to appoint an assistant in the said office so that such an occurrence may not take place again?

(1) It is the case that, owing to the illness of the postmaster and pending the arrival of the relief officer from Bloemfontein, the Bultfontein post office was closed for a period of three days. (2) As the duties at Bultfontein are barely sufficient to fully occupy the time of one officer, the Government would not be justified in appointing a second officer, who would be idle for the greater part of each day. There are over two hundred post offices throughout the Union which are worked single-handed. To duplicate the staff at each of these would involve considerably increased expenditure, which is not warranted.

asked the Minister of Justice: (1) Whether he is aware that litigants in the Southwest of the Cape Province were put to a great deal of inconvenience and unnecessary expense at the sessions of the last Circuit Court owing to the acting judge not having sufficient time locally to dispose of the cases submitted to him; and (2) what steps he intends to take in order to prevent such a state of affairs in future?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE, replying on behalf of the Minister of Justice, said: I have been informed that litigants have been put to inconvenience and unnecessary expense at the last sessions of the South-western Circuit Court in the Cape Province. I find that in order to allow time for the issue of summonses, subpoenas, etc., and for other arrangements to be made, it is necessary to fix the dates for circuit some time before the Court sits. Rather more than the average time was allowed for the sittings at the circuit towns of George and Oudtshoorn in last September and October. But there was an abnormal quantity of work, principally civil, which could not have been foreseen when the circuit dates were fixed. The Court sat on nine days at these two towns, finished the criminal work, heard all the witnesses (more than 50) in the civil cases, with the exception of four witnesses in one case at George, who could not be heard there for lack of time. Several matters not involving witnesses were removed to Cape Town on this account. The circuit judge sat at Oudtshoorn until the latest day which enabled him to get to Cape Town in order to sit on the first day of the Supreme Court term. On this day there were only two other judges available in Cape Town, and there was work set down in three divisions. As will be seen from the above answer, the circumstances last circuit were somewhat exceptional, Arrangements are being made to keep the Bench of the Cape Provincial Division at its full strength (five judges), so that in the event of a circuit sitting being unexpectedly prolonged, it will be possible for the presiding judge to remain on circuit and conclude the work. Attorneys might assist in getting adequate time allowed for circuit by giving to the Magistrate early intimation of any civil cases which are likely to be brought for trial.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether the Railway Board have recommended the construction of the proposed railway line from Magaliesberg through the Moot to Pretoria, in favour of which line a great number of his constituents have sent petitions to Parliament, and whether he intends to include this line in his railway construction proposals this year?

It was very unusual for information of this nature to be supplied before the Construction Programme had been laid before Parliament, and I am afraid my hon. friend will have to possess his soul in patience until such time as the Bill is introduced.

asked the Minister of Mines whether the gold mines on the Witwatersrand are consistently conforming to the provisions of the eight-hours section in the Mines Regulations Act, 1911?

The reply is in the affirmative. A few complaints have been made to the department about men being detained underground beyond the 48 hour limit per week. One of these is under investigation at present, but generally the shift time-tables arranged by managers preclude the possibility of serious infraction of the law.

asked the Minister of the Interior: (1) Whether the Government has taken any steps to ascertain the extent and the amount of the damage caused to houses, kraals, dams, and fountains in the district of Fauresmith by the earthquake in February, 1912; (2) whether in case the above information has not been obtained, steps will be taken to procure the same; and (3) whether, should the losses prove to have been exceptionally severe, the Government will give financial or other assistance to the persons who so suffered?

Very full reports on the amount of damage sustained were submitted by the Resident Magistrate of the district to the Administrator of the Orange Free State, and immediate steps were taken by the Provincial Administration to issue bents to meet the more pressing requirements of the poorer inhabitants whose dwelling-houses had been damaged, but it did not appear to the Government that the destruction of property was on such a scale as to warrant any expenditure of public money in granting a general measure of relief to persons in the area affected by the earthquake.

asked the Minister of Agriculture whether the provisions of sections 28 and 34 of the Fencing Act, 1912, dealing, respectively, with the erection of swing-gates and fences of a superior type are retrospective in effect, or apply only to fences erected under the said Act ?

The MINISTER OF FINANCE, replying on behalf of the Minister of Agriculture, said: Both sections 28 and 34 apply to a swing gate or fence, as the case may be, whether erected before or after the date when the Act came into operation.

for Mr. C. L. BOTHA (Bloemfontein), asked the Minister of Lands: (1) How many allotments have been made under the Land Settlement Act, 1912; (2) how much land has been acquired in terms of section 11 of that Act; and (3) how many applications for land under the Act are under consideration, and how long have they been under consideration ?

(1) One; (2) 1,361 morgen; (3) the following applications are under consideration: (a) Thirty-seven under section 11 of the Act, of which nine have been approved, but have not been completed at the present time. Of the above applications, 20 were received between the 25th November and 31st December last, and 17 since the 31st December. I would also mention that in addition to the applications at present under consideration, twelve have been refused on the recommendation of the Lind Board: eight applications were declined as not meeting the requirements of or being contemplated by the Act, and four applications have been abandoned by the applicants. The total number of applications submitted in terms of section 11 is, therefore, 62. (b) Thirty-four applications have been received for land gazetted in terms of section 16, which cannot be considered until the expiration of the period fixed in accordance with the Act, namely, 10 weeks from the 18th December last.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether his attention has been drawn to the fact that the travelling public suffer great inconvenience by reason of there being no proper platforms at the Parijs and Kopjes railway stations, and if so, whether he intends to take the necessary steps to remedy this state of affairs as soon as possible?

The question of providing platforms at Parijs and Kopjes is under consideration by the administration.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours: (1) Whether plans and specifications have been completed by the Administration for the erection of a railway station at Willowmore, and, if so, whether due consideration has been given to ensure that the grade of the station will be such as to meet the business possibilities of the place as well as the convenience of the travelling and local public; and (2) when a commencement will be made with the building, and what is the probable date of completion ?

(1) Yes. (2) As proposals submitted are still under consideration) it is impossible to say when work will be commenced; but it is hoped that it may be possible to approve of a start, being made with improvements at an early date. It will take about, six months to complete work from date of commencement.

asked the Minister of the Interior whether, in view of the fact that, Civil Servants who joined the services of the late Cape Colony, Transvaal. Natal, and the Orange River Colony prior to Union slid not undertake in their contracts of service to serve outside of their respective colonies, their transfer from the Province in which they joined for service is not a breach of section 145 of the South Africa Act?

So far as I understand the question, section 145 has no bearing on the matter at, all. Section 140 of the South Africa Act provided that at the establishment of Union all officers of the public service of the several colonies became officers of the Union, and the liability of such officer for transfer to any portion of the Union at, once became effective. The principle of liability for transfer to any part of the Union is similarly incorporated in the Public Service and Pensions Act, No. 29 of 1912, section 13.

asked the Minister of Posts and Telegraphs: (1) Whether his attention has been called to the departmental letter of the 20th December, 1912, intimating to sub-postmasters, postal agents, and licensed stamp vendors in the Cape and Orange Free State Provinces that from the 31st of March next the payment of commission on the sale of postage stamps hitherto made will cease? (2) what the said commission is; (3) if this letter is acted upon, what, consideration will such not over-wealthy persons then receive for the considerable services rendered to the public; and (4) whether he will not consider the matter before the said letter is given effect to?

The reply to query No. 1 is in the affirmative. (2) One and a quarter per cent. and two and a half per cent. on sales, according to whether the person concerned merely vends postage stamps or is a sub-postmaster. (3) So far as sub-postmasters and postal agents are concerned, the commission hitherto paid for the sale of postage stamps will be added to the emoluments granted them for the performance of postal duties generally. (4) It is not proposed to reconsider the matter. In the Transvaal and Natal, where no commission has been granted to stamp vendors, there is no lack of applicants for licences to sell postage stamps. It is not anticipated that the experience in the Cape and Orange Free State will be different to that of the Transvaal and Natal. It is necessary to have uniformity in this matter.

asked the Minister of the Interior what steps the Government propose to take to provide increased accommodation in the Cape Peninsula for lunatics and suspected lunatics, in view of the admission made by the Government to the effect that at the present time a man suffering from mental derangement, is confined in a cell in the Cape Town prison, owing to there being no other place in which to confine him ?

As I have already informed the hon. member when he last raised this question, the accommodation for lunatics is entirely inadequate. This state of affairs has existed for some years past, but, for financial reasons apparently, the Cape Government were not in a position to take any steps to extend the asylums. After Union early action was taken to endeavour to bring about, an improvement in the asylums, and during the last two financial years a sum of over £13,000 has been spent in providing extra room for patients at the Valkenberg Asylum, and an additional expenditure of at least £5,000 is contemplated at the same institution in the ensuing year. The need for extension does not, unfortunately, exist only in the Western Province, as asylums all over the Union are, in a more or less congested condition; but I may say for the information of the House that the Government has before it a comprehensive scheme for the extension of asylums in those centres where the need is most felt, and I am hopeful that at an early date funds may become available for putting this most necessary work in hand.

asked the Minister of Native Affairs whether, in view of the proposed arrangement between the Portuguese authorities in Mozambique and the Witwatersrand Native Labour Association whereby part of the wages of native labourers imported from Mozambique are to be withheld from them and paid in Portuguese territory, any instructions have been given to the Director as to giving or withholding his consent under section 15 of the Native Labour Regulation Act, 1911, or any arrangement has been made with the Witwatersrand Native Labour Association as to the giving or withholding of such consent?

said: The answer to each question is in the negative. I am advised that the arrangement referred to, which provides for an extension of the existing system of deferred payment of wages, does not involve any breach of the Native Labour Regulation Act. The system, it may be mentioned, has been in operation since 1903, when it originated with an experimental batch of 1,000 natives from British Nyassaland; in 1904, it was applied in respect of Portuguese Nyassaland natives; in 1905, to those from Quilimane and Tete; and in 1909, to those from Mozambique.

asked the Minister of Lands whether he is aware of the great dissatisfaction existing amongst the inhabitants of the Mapoch territory in the district of Middelburg, Transvaal, owing to the absence of a proper arrangement at present both in regard to the distribution of water and pasture lands, and, if so, whether he will inform the House what steps he intends taking to assist the people there and to ensure adequate provision in regard to the said matters complained of in order to terminate the unsatisfactory state of affairs at that place?

I am aware that difficulty has arisen at Mapoch’s Gronden in connection with the action of certain inhabitants in the use of the water and common pasturage, but would point out to the hon. member that the only method of regularising matters is to have the water rights defined by a Water Court, and then to create a River Board in terms of the Irrigation Act to see that those rights are observed and the water is distributed in accordance with them. I am doubtful whether the holders will face the expense of a Water Court and the establishment of a River Board, but the matter cannot be dealt with otherwise unless by legislation, which Government is not prepared to consider. Regulations relating to the pasturage are at the present time being drafted and when settled will be promulgated in terms of the title deeds under which the land is held.

asked the Minister of Lands: (1) Whether the Government has offered any holdings for allotment to applicants from oversea in terms of section 17 of the Land Settlement Act, 1912. and, if not, when is it their intention to do so; and (2) whether the Government has as yet caused work and labour to be done on any holdings offered or to be offered for allotment under the said Act, in terms of section 44 thereof, and whether it is their intention to use their power under this section to introduce into the Union the principle of the “Ready-made Farm ” for settlers?

The reply to the first part of question (1) of the hon. member is in the negative, and, as regards the latter part of the question, the matter will have consideration when land suitable for the purpose has been acquired by Government. The reply to both portions of question (2) of the hon. member is also in the negative.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours when it is expected that the railway extension from Butterworth to Idutywa will be completed, and what have been the causes of the great delay which has taken place in the construction of the line?

Traffic will be accepted by construction train on, and after the 21st instant, and the line will, it is anticipated, be properly opened for traffic some time in April next. The time taken to complete the work is due partly to the fact that until the river immediately outside Butterworth Station had been bridged, platelaying ballasting and the erection of buildings could not he proceeded with, and partly to the delay that occurred in the delivery of certain material required for this line, consequent upon industrial disputes oversea.

asked the Minister of Mines: (1) What was the total amount of money expended in installing and experimenting with the Way-Arbuckle reduction plant on the Apex Gold Mining and Benoni Consolidated Companies at Benoni; (2) is it not a fact that this plant had previously been tried upon another mine on the Witwatersrand and proved a failure; and (3) whether he is aware that these two mines were closed down as a result of shortage of money, and in view of the waste referred to in paragraph (1) hereof; and whether he will cause enquiry to be made, with the view of ordering a restart to be made immediately ?

(1) I have no official information in regard to the first portion of the question beyond what has been published in the Companies’ reports. (2) The process referred to by the honourable member was tried on the East Rand Proprietary Mines on a small scale, to the satisfaction of the directors of the Benoni Consolidated Company. (3) It is understood that the mines were closed down owing to want of funds. I am informed that negotiations are in progress for the provision of further ample funds for developing these properties, and that an early resumption of work may be anticipated. Under the circumstances no useful purpose would be served by causing an enquiry to be made.

asked the Minister of Lands: (1) Whether he is aware of the large and growing number of men who are unemployed in Johannesburg, Pretoria, and other large towns? (2) Whether he has under consideration any schemes for relieving this unemployment by giving opportunities to such men to have access to the land; and (3) whether he proposes to take action, and whether, if legislation is required, such legislation will be submitted to the House this session?

(1) My attention has not been specially directed to this matter; (2) and (3) it is hoped to introduce legislation during the present session dealing with the settlement of indigents on the land.

asked what steps have been taken by the Government to cope with the hate threatened scarcity of foodstuffs for natives in certain portions of the Transkeian Territories.

Immediately on receipt of notification from local officers in Pondoland some five months ago that a serious shortage existed in the food supply, enquiry was made by Government, with a view to considering how the distress among the local natives could best be alleviated.

It was ascertained that in Pondoland the ravages of East Coast fever and the prevalence of drought over an extended period had resulted in a serious shrinkage of the road transport service, and that local storekeepers were therefore unable to obtain a sufficient supply of grain to meet the constant demand by natives. Reports went to show that natives had been going out freely to work, and that as a rule the means of purchase were available had the supply been adequate.

To meet the difficulty in East Pondoland arrangements were entered into with the South African Railway Administration for the transfer to Paddock Station in Natal of auxiliary means of transport. The action of Government had a good effect in that private transport owners were encouraged to come forward with their wagons. Subsequently instructions were issued for the wagons serving at Paddock Station to proceed to Port St. John, with the same result as at Paddock, viz., that an adequate supply of private transport was soon forthcoming. The Government wagons were thereupon withdrawn. Unfortunately the S.S. Frontier, one of the two boats which had been engaged in the conveyance of grain by sea to Port St. John, ran aground at St. John during last week, with the result that supplies have been reduced, and the position of natives, especially in Lusikisiki has again become serious. The Government is, however, arranging with the Harbour Administration and with private individuals for the early resumption of a satisfactory sea service, and it is earnestly hoped that normal conditions in that portion of the Territories will soon be restored.

asked the Minister of Mines: (1) How long the Cloverfield, Van Dyk, Groot Vlei, and Welgedacht gold mines have been closed down; and (2) whether he has any information of the probable dates of restarting, and, if not, whether he will cause inquiry to be made?

(1) The mines named by the hon. member have been closed down for the following periods: Cloverfield, 26 months; Van Dyk, 27 months; Groot Vlei, 29 months Welgedacht, 15 months. (2) I am informed that all four companies are waiting for a favourable financial market to raise the money necessary to prosecute operations on an adequate scale. (Laughter.)

asked the Minister of the Interior when the syllabus for the Administrative Examination required in terms of the Public Service and Pensions Act, 1912, will be published?

I presume the hon. member is referring to the examination provided for by section 7 of the Public Service and Pensions Act. The syllabus for that examination has recently been received from the Commission, and will, it is hoped, be published within the next fortnight or three weeks.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether he will take into consideration the advisability of building a railway between Springs and the Witbank line as originally promised by the Transvaal Administration ?

I am not in a position to supply any information on this question at present.

asked the Minister of the Interior whether the Government has any information with regard to the alleged process of Mr. Hatfield, or others, of Californa, for rain-making, and whether he would lay such information before Parliament?

The late Meteorological Commission of the Cape of Good Hope investigated the alleged process of Mr. Hatfield, of California, some years ago, and the experts were satisfied that the matter was not worthy of further consideration. The Union Meteorologist has lately again had his attention drawn to the matter, but no evidence exists that the process is of any practical or scientific value. The department is, however, communicating with the United States Weather Bureau in regard to this matter.

asked the Minister of Mines whether the Government during the past year inquired into the working of the Wonder Mine in the Vryheid district, Natal, and, if so, by whom was such inquiry conducted, and was a report made to the Government?

The answer is in the affirmative. An inquiry was held and a report made by a committee consisting of the Inspector of Mines for Natal and Mr. Howard Pirn, of Johannesburg.

asked the Minister of Mines: (1) Whether his attention has been called to the statement reported to have been made by the Magistrate who conducted the inquest upon the victims of the recent dynamite explosion at De Beers Factory, Somerset Strand, to the effect that at the time of the explosion natives were performing duties which were entrusted to a European, who could not reasonably be expected to supervise such work owing to his having to perform work in the nature of task or piecework; (2) whether he has instituted any inquiry into the causes of the explosion; and (3) whether he will frame and enforce regulations with a view to preventing a recurrence of accidents from similar causes?

(1) My attention has been drawn to the Magistrate’s finding in the inquest on the victims of the recent explosion at De Beers Factory. (2) A full technical inquiry has been conducted under chapter XI. of the Explosives Regulations by the Chief Inspector of Explosives, and his report has been already received by the Government. A supplementary inquiry in connection with certain evidence is being conducted this week, and all papers will be placed on the table as soon as possible. (3) The question of the necessity for further regulations will be decided when the report of the Chief Inspector of Explosives has received consideration.

asked the Minister of Railways and Harbours whether he is aware that the train leaving Muizenberg on week days at 8.11 a.m., and Kenilworth at 8.35 a.m., is invariably overcrowded before it reaches Cape Town; and whether he is prepared to take into favourable consideration the advisability of issuing instructions for another coach to be added to the train?

Yes; and arrangements have now been made for an additional first-class coach to be attached to this train. Yesterday (Monday) morning, the position was accentuated by an unfortunate derailment at Wynberg, and the necessity of cancelling the preceding train, thus resulting in the passengers who ordinarily travel by that train having to be accommodated in the Muizenberg train.

moved the adjournment of the House on a definite matter of urgent public importance, viz.: The nature of the reply given by the Minister of Finance this afternoon to a question on the subject of the proposed arrangement between the Portuguese authorities in Mozambique and the Witwatersrand Native Labour Association, and the injury inflicted by such proposed arrangement.

I do not think that the proposed motion is one contemplated by Standing Order No. 29. The Rules and practice of the House have always deprecated a debate on replies to questions given by Ministers. This matter is not of such urgency or importance that it cannot be proceeded with by way of motion on notice in the usual way.

moved: That the Accountants’ Registration Bill be referred to a Select Committee, the members to be appointed under Standing Order No. 331.

seconded.

The motion was agreed to.

moved: (1) That, owing to the varying values of land in the different Provinces, a uniform fencing law for the whole Union is not only impracticable, but leads to dissatisfaction, unless a standard for fencing farms is defined; and (2) that the Government be requested during the present session to introduce a Bill empowering the Provincial Councils to fix the standard of fending for their respective Provinces. The speaker said it was, as a rule, a good thing to make the laws uniform, but there was no rule without an exception. There were exceptions in connection with the Fencing Act. When the Bill was dealt with last year, it was felt that the absence of a standard fence was a difficulty, but it was stated that no standard could be fixed. There were farms, it was said, the value of which only justified a fence of two wires. Then a schedule of standard fences was proposed, but was not accepted. Then it was proposed that where two parties failed to agree, they could apply to a court of arbitration. That provision did not, however, seem to be a practicable one, as it was against the principle of farmers, who did not wish to take their neighbours into court, because of the costs which would be incurred thereby. That neighbour was often a poor farmer, with a mortgaged farm, and if he were to be required to comply with the requirements of the Fencing Act, he would have to apply to the Government for help. Such people were specially opposed to arbitration courts. The speaker hoped that all members from the Orange Free State would support him, though he also reckoned on a favourable decision by the Government. The Provincial Council bad the right to legislate in the matter of roads, and in the Free State that had been done in a very progressive way. If they could do it for roads, why could not they do it for fences? He was sorry he had not widened his motion to include district councils.

seconded the motion.

hoped the mover would withdraw his proposition. The last speaker knew what difficulty they had last year in dealing with the Fencing Act. There was much difference of opinion, and the discussions had occupied a good deal of time. And yet an excellent law had been passed, much better than they had expected. They should, as far as possible, regard such matters as that as Union matters, and not pass them over to the Provinces. If Parliament agreed to allow the Provincial Councils to lay down a standard fence, it would not have any good effect. Last year they had almost succeeded in fixing a standard fence, hut had abandoned it in time. If the Provincial Councils tried to do a similar thing, they would have a great deal of trouble, seeing that not in even one Province were the conditions all alike. In the Free State, for example, they required jackal-proof fences in the west, whilst in Harrismith and Vrede the horse-breeding farmers could do with a lighter fence. In case a difference arose between two neighbours about the fence, then they could try to come to an arrangement, or failing that, appoint a court of arbitration themselves. If the farmers used their understanding if would never be necessary to incur costs.

regretted he could not support the motion. If they were going to try to determine a fixed standard of fence, they would never come to an agreement, and they could not hope to settle the difficulty by transferring it to the Provincial Councils. There would also be differences of opinion in the Provincial Councils, and their difficulties would be just as great. If there were Divisional Councils in each of the Provinces, he would be in favour of handing the matter over to them—(hear, hear)—because the members of such Councils would include men well acquainted with local conditions. Clause 40 of the Fencing Act should, he thought, be amended. According to that clause, the Railway Administration was required to maintain the fences along its lines, provided, however, that the Governor-General, by means of a proclamation in the “Government Gazette,” could exempt a line from the operation of the clause. Parliament had scarcely prorogued last year, when such a proclamation appeared in the “Gazette,” stating that the fences along a certain railway line would not be maintained by the Administration. He would move an amendment to the motion, namely, to leave out all words after “that,” and to insert the following: “The Government fake into consideration the desirability of introducing legislation during the current Session to amend section 40 of the Fencing Act, 1912, by omitting the words ‘except in such areas as the Governor-General may by proclamation in the Gazette exempt from the operation of this section.’ ”

seconded the amendment.

thought the law should be given a chance, for six months, and although he felt for the motion, he thought the law should be taken to be a result of Union. It was felt in the Free State that the Act did not help them much, but they ought to give it a little time. He agreed with the amendment, and held that the Government was not administering that part of the Act in the manner intended by this House.

said it seemed to be the sense of the House not to pass this resolution. To his mind, the resolution was the direct outcome of the very crude and ill-thought-out Bill introduced into the House last session, which was only knocked into shape by the exertions of hon. members on that side of the House. (Hear, hear, and Ministerial dissent.) On the subject of a standard fence, the Government seemed to have no mind. In obedience to a section of their supporters, they introduced a standard fence, but a week afterwards, in obedience to another section, they withdrew it. Here they were once more faced with the question of the standard fence. It seemed to him that this question was going to become one of the hardy annuals of the House. Why? Because the Government had introduced a Bill last session without due consideration, and consequently that Bill had nobody’s support. The hon. member for Edenburg seemed to realise the fact that the Government, as constituted at present, was unable to deal with this important question of a standard fence, and therefore the question should be taken out of their hands and handed over to the Provincial Councils. Last year the Government failed ignominiously to deal with it. If it were handed over to the Provincial Councils, would it improve the position in the slightest degree? He could not understand that the value of land had anything to do with the question of fencing. They would never get a settlement of this question except on the basis that it was the duty of every man to fence in his own stock. At present they were going on the principle that it was not the duty of a man to fence in his own stock, but to fence out his neighbour’s. He thought the best thing to do would be to allow the Fencing Act as it was passed last year to continue in force for a number of years, and then when they had got a Unionist Party in power—(Ministerial cries of “Oh”)—they would be able to pass a Bill which would place the whole matter on a proper footing.

also objected to the motion owing to the diverse interests of the country at large, and thought it was not necessary to fix a standard fence in one law. He agreed with the amendment. He had not been in favour of clause 40 of the Act, but had had confidence in the Government. He could not, however, agree with the way in which the Government had administered this clause, and had never expected that the Government would make such immediate use of its provisions. It was not fair that farmers, having allowed a railway line to run over their land, should now be asked to pay half the cost of a fence erected along the line. The clause would have to be amended.

†The MINISTER OF FINANCE thought the time had not come for a motion of this kind. He referred to the difficulties which the Government had had in passing a Bill acceptable to everyone He thought if the motion were accepted it would occupy Parliament a long time to pass such a measure, whilst the Provincial Councils would have even greater difficulties than_ the Government had last session. The public were not in favour of litigation and heavy costs. He thought the arbitration provided for in the law was of the simplest and cheapest nature, and should not be altered’. If the law proved to be a failure it would be different, but under present circumstances he did not see the necessity for the amendment of the law. As regarded the amendment proposed by the hon. member for Bechuanaland, he did not see what it had to do with the motion, as it concerned a totally different question. The hon. member should have made an independent motion of this matter, so that the whole question could have been looked into and answered by the Minister of Railways and Harbours. He doubted whether any injustice had been done, but he hoped the hon. member would bring his difficulties personally to the notice of the Minister. They had had the pleasure this afternoon of listening to an extraordinary speech from the agricultural expert of the Opposition—the hon. member for Turffontein—and after his explanation they should have no difficulty in understanding the difficulties. (Laughter.) If the hon. member for Edenburg persisted in his motion, then he would support the hon. member for Turffontein in obtaining an early Unionist Government.

withdrew his amendment.

The motion was negatived.

moved that the petition from C. Long, a retired civil servant, praying for the consideration of the circumstances of his case and for relief, presented to the House on the 29th of February, 1912, be laid upon the Table.

econded.

Agreed to.

Mr. SPEAKER stated that the petition was on the Table.

Sir D. HUNTER then moved that the petition be referred to the Select Committee on Pensions, Grants and Gratuities.

Sir W. B. BERRY seconded.

Agreed to.

moved that a Select Committee be appointed to investigate the desirability or otherwise of introducing legislation to provide for the regulation of certain fidei-commissary bequests in wills of deceased persons, the committee to have power to take evidence and call for papers and to consist of Messrs. Krige, Mentz, C. L. Botha, Cronje, Duncan, Meyler, Andrews, and the mover. Mr. Grobler pointed to the present difficulties experienced by legatees, especially owing to the different procedures in vogue in the various Provinces. There were farms in the Transvaal, and also in the other Provinces, which were so sub-divided, that the owners refused to pay the transfer costs, on the ground that the value of the land was less than such costs. Those costs were further increased by taxation, and if the Government did not help the people, the costs would finally become unbearable. The speaker knew of one case where the owners could sell their farm, because it was thought to contain minerals. But the will forbade a sale. The farm now belonged to about 400 persons, and every part of the farm was without value. In the Free State they could in such a case go to the Courts, which could give an order, after which they could apply to Parliament. That was an expensive matter. In the Cape also it was a most expensive procedure to get rid of such testamentary stipulations, whilst in the Transvaal and Natal it was totally impossible to escape from them. He did not wish to cause the Government any great expense. He thought the Select Committee should especially take the evidence of judges and masters of the Supreme Court that a proper solution might be arrived at. At present they offer found wills which it was impossible to execute.

supported the motion.

who seconded the motion referred to the difficulties experienced in the Cape, and pointed out that in his constituency many parts were so subdivided that they looked like white locations. The result was racial retrogression, for it was impossible to make a living on such small areas.

†The MINISTER OF FINANCE agreed with the motion. An Estate Bill was, he said, under consideration in the Senate, and it might be possible to use the evidence produced by the proposed Select Committee for the purpose of amending the Bill in question when it was sent down. There often were wills which it was practically impossible to execute, and some way out of the difficulty should be found.

The motion was agreed to.

moved that the petition from H. R. L. Smith, district clerk in the South African Railways, Natal, praying that certain breaks in his service may be condoned for pension purposes or for other relief, presented to the House on the 18th June, 1912, be laid upon the Table.

seconded.

Agreed to.

Mr. SPEAKER stated that the petition was on the Table.

Mr. FAWCUS then moved that the petition be referred to the Select Committee on Pensions, Grants and Gratuities.

Mr. H. W. SAMPSON seconded.

Agreed to.

on behalf of Mr. J. J. Alberts (Standerton) moved that the petition from Stephanus Kriegler Hauptfleisch, a teacher in the service of the Education Department, Transvaal, praying that the first year of his service, viz., July, 1908, to June, 1909, during which there was a break owing to an inspector’s report, be reckoned for purposes of leave, or for other relief, presented to the House on the 11th June, 1912, be laid upon the Table.

seconded.

Agreed to.

Mr. SPEAKER stated that the petition was on the Table.

Genl. T. SMUTS then moved that the petition be referred to the Select Committee on Pensions, Grants and Gratuities.

Mr. J. A. VENTER seconded.

Agreed to.

The motion was agreed to.

moved that in the opinion of this House a fair wage clause should be inserted in all Public Works contracts irrespective of Province, and that no discrimination should be made on the ground of the colour of the workmen engaged. The mover said the principle had been applied in the Transvaal, Natal, and the Free State. He was informed that in the Cape a fair wage clause had been inserted in contracts, and in one case it was stated that only skilled white men should be employed.

He knew there were coloured men in the Cape Province who were doing skilled men’s work, but when it came to payment for the work they were ruled out, because they were coloured men. If these men were competent and employed to do skilled work, they were entitled to the skilled men’s pay. If they were going to discriminate against a man because his pigment was a little more or a little less than another’s, they were going on principles which were absolutely false and unjust. They asked that this fair wage clause should be applied all round. As long as the Government demanded standard work they should be prepared to and should provide standard pay. They had the fair wage clause in Natal, in the Transvaal, and in the Free State. All they asked for was that the sound principle should be applied that standard pay should be given for standard work, without discrimination as to colour. He asked the Minister to extend to the Cape Province a principle which was in operation in the other Provinces.

seconded the motion.

moved to omit all the words after “ Province ” for the purpose of inserting, “ and that the standard wage of the district for standard work should be secured for every workman, whether white or coloured.” He said he did so, not because he did not believe that every word the mover of the motion had said was true, and that his arguments were perfectly logical and sound, but they had to face things in this country as they found them, and they knew that in one of the Northern Provinces of this country there had existed this particular fair wage clause which had confined the work to whites. For many years in that Province the coloured men in skilled occupations were practically unknown, but in recent years a large influx of coloured people had taken place, and there was no provision ensuring them a standard wage, and for that reason the Government of this country had allowed a stronger prejudice than ever to grow up against the people who were performing this work. He thought it would be premature at the present time to attempt to alter the position of affairs, and until all men were treated economically on the same footing he thought it would be undesirable to press the motion as proposed.

seconded the amendment.

said that he would accept the amendment.

said that, now that the motion had been withdrawn, and practically a new motion put before the House, the position was somewhat changed, but he did not think anl good case had been made out for the House to pass this resolution. It seemed to him that there had been no complaints on the part of the Government in regard to the carrying out of contracts, and, as far as he was aware, no complaints had been made by the other parties to the contracts, namely, the employers. Neither had the employees complained. It seemed to him that the state of affairs would remain exactly the same even if they passed this resolution and that, as a matter of fact, the House was not called upon to express any definite opinion whatever. They must have regard to existing facts. They had to recognise in this connection that certain trades in the Cape Province were-entirely in the hands of coloured men; others again were partly in the hands of coloured men; and very few, he believed, were entirely in the hands of white men. They found that that state of affairs existed not only in Cape Town and the Peninsula, but in all the principal towns of the Cape Province. In the rural districts, on the other hand, he was informed that they experienced great difficulty in getting white men to do any work. It seemed to him that the House would be very well advised to let matters remain as they were. When the Act of Union was being drafted, he thought the right and statesmanlike view of the position was taken in regard to the franchise, when no attempt was made to bar the coloured man of the Cape from voting, but the coloured franchise was not extended to the other Provinces, and in regard to the fair wages clause we ought to proceed on similar lines. He thought their friends on the Labour benches ought to be satisfied now that the system of the fair-wage clause in Government contracts had been extended to the Free State. If they fixed a white standard in the Cape Province, they were going to squeeze out the coloured man entirely. (Hear, hear.)

Why?

said it was recognised by all employers of labour in this Province and throughout South Africa that the coloured man was not as efficient an artisan as the white man. If they fixed a white standard, they not only increased the cost of all Government work, but they froze out the coloured man. He had it from employers of labour that they would not employ coloured men if they had to pay them on the white standard, and these coloured men, it should be remembered, were citizens of this country, born in this country, men who had served an apprenticeship to trades in the country, and why should they pass a resolution which would have the effect of barring these men from earning their daily bread?

Hear, hear; pay them proper wages.

said that if they were paid proper wages, i.e., white men’s wages, they would be driven into the ranks of the unemployed or become unskilled labourers. He hoped the House would vote against the amendment.

said that what the Minister had said amounted to this: that the coloured man working for a less wage than the white man must be allowed to be paid a less rate for standard work, and the white man must gradually give way. If the House took the view that in all Government business the least possible wage was to be paid to any man who would do the work, and if the resisting power of the coloured man was, as it generally was, less than prevailed amongst the white population, the effect would be that the Government were going to give more and more to the coloured man and less and less to the white man. He disputed the contention of the Minister that the coloured tradesman would be condemned to second place, and thrown out of employment. It was impossible to imagine that all of a sudden they were going to have spring up a supply of white men in all the country districts, who were going to take the place of the coloured. If the coloured man was not able to hold his own and do standard work for standard wages, he would have to pay the penalty, just as the white man must. They were asking no more for him than would apply to the white man. The Minister the other day said that in the Free State, in Natal, and in the Transvaal the Government made it obligatory upon all their contractors that they should pay the standard wage. The Minister of Railways, on the other hand, proposed that Bloemfontein and other large areas should pay 2s. less than the standard rate. Was the Government policy different to the policy of hon. members sitting on both sides of the House: that it was the soundest principle of public business to pay the least possible wage they could.

At this stage,

Mr. SPEAKER intervened, saying he would like to ask the Minister of Public Works whether, if this resolution was passed by the House, and was given effect to by the Government it would put a further burden on the Government, and increase the expenditure of the Government in connection with Public Works.

said if the white standard of wages was fixed it would, but if the coloured standard was fixed it would not.

This motion, if adopted, would, I think, involve an increase of expenditure, and is therefore in conflict with the terms of section 62 of the South Africa Act. I must accordingly rule that both the amendment and the original motion are out of order and must be discharged.

the mover of the resolution, said he assumed he would be allowed to bring forward a further motion.

replied in the affirmative.

moved that all reports and papers in connection with the railway surveys which were made last year for the proposed lines between Somerset East and Klipplaat Station, and Somerset East via Pearston to the western line, be laid upon the table of the House.

second ed.

The motion was agreed to.