→ House of Assembly → 1989 → MARCH, 1989 → House of Assembly: Vol13 - THURSDAY 2 MARCH 1989

House of Assembly: Vol13 - THURSDAY 2 MARCH 1989

THURSDAY, 2 MARCH 1989 HOUSE OF ASSEMBLY QUESTIONS

†Indicates translated version.

For written reply

General Affairs:

Edendale: patients admitted to hospitals 63. Mr M J ELLIS

asked the Minister of National Health and Population Development:

  1. (a) How many patients were admitted on a daily basis to hospitals in the Edendale area of Pietermaritzburg in 1987 and 1988, respectively, and (b) what are the names of the hospitals involved?

B163E

 The MINISTER OF NATIONAL HEALTH AND POPULATION DEVELOPMENT:

The Edendale area is geographically situated in KwaZulu. The Department of National Health and Population Development does not keep statistics with regard to hospitals falling under the jurisdiction of the KwaZulu Government.

  1. (a) and (b) fall away.
 SATS: loss incurred on commuter services 70. Mr D J N MALCOMESS

asked the Minister of Transport Affairs:

What was the total loss incurred by the South African Transport Services on commuter services in the (a) Johannesburg/Pretoria, (b) Cape Town/Peninsula, (c) Port Elizabeth/Uitenhage and (d) Durban/Pinetown areas in the 1988/89 financial year?

B171E

 The MINISTER OF TRANSPORT AFFAIRS:

The total estimated loss in respect of each of the areas is as follows:

R — million

  1. (a) 405
  2. (b) 182
  3. (c) 10
  4. (d) 147
 Strikes/discontinuances of work 71. Mr P G SOAL

asked the Minister of Manpower:

  1. (1) How many (a) strikes as defined in section 65 of the Labour Relations Act, No 28 of 1956, and (b) discontinuances of work reportable in terms of section 65A of the said Act took place in 1988;
  2. (2) how many (a)(i) recognition and (ii) other agreements have been filed with his Department in terms of section 31A of this Act since 1 September 1984 and (b) status quo orders in terms of section 43 of the Act were (i) granted and (ii) refused by the Industrial Court in 1988?

B172E

 The MINISTER OF MANPOWER:
  1. (1)
    1. (a) 945
    2. (b) 945 strikes
      80 work stoppages
      1 025 total discontinuances of work reported
  2. (2)
    1. (a)
      1. (i) 295
      2. (ii) 1 791
    2. (b)
      1. (i) 179
      2. (ii) 274
 Transkei: amount paid in terms of agreements 76. Mr R A F SWART

asked the Minister of Foreign Affairs:

  1. (1) (a) What total amount was paid by South Africa to Transkei in the 1988/89 financial year in terms of agreements between the two countries and (b) how was this amount made up;
  2. (2) whether any additional amounts have been paid to Transkei in the form of (a) loans or (b) grants; if so, (i) how many, and (ii) what was the amount of the loan or grant, in each case;
  3. (3) whether any further (a) loans or (b) grants are envisaged in the 1989/90 financial year; if so, what loans or grants?

B178E

 The MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS:
  1. 1.
    1. (a) An estimated amount of R1 379 237 333.
    2. (b) The estimated amounts which will be paid to Transkei during the 1988/89 financial year fall into two main categories, namely:
    3. A. DIRECT ASSISTANCE
      1. (i) An estimated amount for budgetary assistance under Programme 3: Foreign Aid and Development Co-operation of Vote 7: Foreign Affairs R711 766 000.
      2. (ii) Technical assistance
        South African is from time to time approached by other governments with requests for assistance in one way or another. Assistance may take the form of expert advice, visits evaluation of projects, bursaries etc. Each such application is considered on its merits. During the 1988/89 financial year the RSA will spend an estimated amount of R694 000 in this regard on Transkei.
      3. (iii) Loan Fund
        Like any other friendly country Transkei may apply for the financing of certain projects within the framework of the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund. Such applications are considered strictly on merit according to fixed criteria and within the limits of available funds. This type of financing consists mainly of loans which are repayable. During the 1988/89 financial year an estimated amount of R12 980 000 will be paid to Transkei.
      4. (iv) Incentive scheme for Industries
        In accordance with existing jointly agreed arrangements between the SATBVC States, the RSA is obliged to refund the TBVC States on a rand-for-rand basis for actual expenditure incurred in these states in terms of the industrial incentive scheme, which took effect on 1 April 1982. The RSA estimates to refund Transkei to the amount of R20 000 000 in this regard during the 1988/89 financial year.
    4. B. TRANSFERS IN TERMS OF BILATERAL AGREEMENTS Transfer payments which are regarded as own sources of income of the Transkei Government:
      1. (i) Income tax. An estimated amount of R157 273 000 will be transferred.
      2. (ii) An estimated amount of R458 231 000 will be paid in respect of Transkei’s share in the Customs Union Revenue Pool.
      3. (iii) Common Monetary Area: An estimated amount of R18 293 333 will be transferred.
  2. (2)
    1. (a) No. Loans in terms of project aid agreements are included in the amount mentioned under (1)(a).
      1. (i) and (ii) fall away.
    2. (b) Yes.
      1. (i) One.
      2. (ii) Transfers in respect of the action programme: Creation of Job Opportunities are estimated at R4 500 000.
  3. (3)
    1. (a) Yes. Loans are granted on a continuous basis within the framework of the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund as set out in (1)(b)(iii).
    2. (b) Yes. The same type of grant which was made during the 1988/89 financial year.
 Bophuthatswana: amount paid in terms of agreements 77. Mr R A F SWART

asked the Minister of Foreign Affairs:

  1. (1) (a) What total amount was paid by South Africa to Bophuthatswana in the 1988/89 financial year in terms of agreements between the two countries and (b) how was this amount made up;
  2. (2) whether any additional amounts have been paid to Bophuthatswana in the form of (a) loans or (b) grants; if so, (i) how many, and (ii) what was the amount of the loan or grant, in each case;
  3. (3) whether any further (a) loans or (b) grants are envisaged in the 1989/90 financial year; if so, what loans or grants?
 The MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS:
  1. (1)
    1. (a) An estimated amount of R1 067 901 333.
    2. (b) The estimated amounts which will be paid to Bophuthatswana during the 1988/89 financial year fall into two main categories, mainly:
  1. A. DIRECT ASSISTANCE
    1. (i) An amount for budgetary assistance under Programme 3: Foreign Aid and Development Co-operation of Vote 7: Foreign Affairs R447 223 000.
    2. (ii) Technical assistance
      South Africa is from time to time approached by other governments with requests for assistance in one way or another. Assistance may take the form of expert advice, visits, evaluation of projects, bursaries etc. Each such application is considered on its merits. During the 1988/89 financial year the RSA will spend an estimated amount of R942 000 in this regard on Bophuthatswana.
    3. (iii) Loan Fund
      Like any other friendly country Bophuthatswana may apply for the financing of certain projects within the framework of the Economic Cooperation Promotion Loan Fund. Such applications are considered strictly on merit according to fixed criteria and within the limits of available funds. This type of financing consists mainly of loans which are repayable. During the 1988/89 financial year an estimated amount of R22 537 000 will be paid to Bophuthatswana.
    4. (iv) Incentive scheme for Industries
      In accordance with existing jointly agreed arrangements between the SATBVC States, the RSA is obliged to refund the TBVC States on a rand-for-rand basis for actual expenditure incurred in these states in terms of the industrial incentive scheme, which took effect on 1 April 1982. The RSA estimates to refund Bophuthatswana to the amount of R13 000 000 in this regard during the 1988/89 financial year.
  2. B. TRANSFERS IN TERMS OF BILATERAL AGREEMENTS
    Transfer payments which are regarded as own sources of income of the Bophuthatswana Government:
    1. (i) Income tax; An estimated amount of R59 414 000 will be transferred.
    2. (ii) An estimated amount of R516 028 000 will be paid in respect of Bophuthatswana’s share in the Customs Union Revenue Pool.
    3. (iii) Common Monetary Area: An estimated amount of R8 757 333 will be transferred.
  1. (2)
    1. (a) No. Loans in terms of project aid agreements are included in the amount mentioned under (1)(a).
      1. (i) and (ii) fall away.
    2. (b) Yes.
      1. (i) One.
      2. (ii) Transfers in respect of the action programme: Creation of Job Opportunities are estimated at R8 000 000.
  2. (3)
    1. (a) Yes. Loans are granted on a continuous basis within the framework of the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund as set out in (1)(b)(iii).
    2. (b) Yes. The same type of grant which was made during the 1988/89 financial year.
 Venda: amount paid in terms of agreements 78. Mr R A F SWART

asked the Minister of Foreign Affairs:

  1. (1) (a) What total amount was paid by South Africa to Venda in the 1988/89 financial year in terms of agreements between the two countries and (b) how was this amount made up;
  2. (2) whether any additional amounts have been paid to Venda in the form of (a) loans or (b) grants; if so, (i) how many, and (ii) what was the amount of the loan or grant, in each case;
  3. (3) whether any further (a) loans or (b) grants are envisaged in the 1989/90 financial year; if so, what loans or grants?

B180E

 The MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS:
  1. (1)
    1. (a) An estimated amount of R352 934 666.
    2. (b) The estimated amounts which will be paid to Venda during the 1988/89 financial year fall into two main categories, namely:
    1. A. DIRECT ASSISTANCE
      1. (i) An estimated amount for budgetary assistance under Programme 3: Foreign Aid and Development Co-operation of Vote 7: Foreign Affairs R228 571 000.
      2. (ii) Technical assistance
        South Africa is from time to time approached by other governments with requests for assistance in one way or another. Assistance may take the form of expert advice, visits, evaluation of projects, bursaries etc. Each such application is considered on its merits. During the 1988/89 financial year the RSA will spend an estimated amount of R665 000 in this regard on Venda.
      3. (iii) Loan Fund
        Like any other friendly country Venda may apply for the financing of certain projects within the framework of the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund. Such applications are considered strictly on merit according to fixed criteria and within the limits of available funds. This type of financing consists mainly of loans which are repayable. During the 1988/89 financial year an estimated amount of R19 025 000 will be paid to Venda.
      4. (iv) Incentive scheme for Industries
        In accordance with existing jointly agreed arrangements between the SATBVC States, the RSA is obliged to refund the TB VC States on a rand-for-rand basis for actual expenditure incurred in these states in terms of the industrial incentive scheme, which took effect on 1 April 1982. The RSA estimates to refund Venda to the amount of R5 000 000 in this regard during the 1988/89 financial year.
  2. B. TRANSFERS IN TERMS OF BILATERAL AGREEMENTS
    Transfer payments which are regarded as own sources of income of the Venda Government:
    1. (i) Income tax; An estimated amount of R10 322 000 will be transferred.
    2. (ii) An estimated amount of R86 653 000 will be paid in respect of Venda’s share in the Customs Union Revenue Pool.
    3. (iii) Common Monetary Area: An estimated amount of R2 698 666 will be transferred.
  1. (2)
    1. (a) No. Loans in terms of project aid agreements are included in the amount mentioned under (1)(a).
      1. (i) and (ii) fall away.
    2. (b) Yes.
      1. (i) One.
      2. (ii) Transfers in respect of the action programme: Creation of Job Opportunities are estimated at R3 000 000.
  2. (3)
    1. (a) Yes. Loans are granted on a continuous basis within the framework of the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund as set out in (1)(b)(iii).
    2. (b) Yes. The same type of grant which was made during the 1988/89 financial year.
 HOUSE OF DELEGATES INTERPELLATIONS

The sign * indicates a translation. The sign †, used subsequently in the same interpellation, indicates the original language.

General Affairs:

Klip River: dam to control flood waters

1. Dr J N REDDY

asked the Minister of Water Affairs:

Whether a decision has been taken to construct a storage dam on the Klip River in Ladysmith in order to control flood waters; if so, when is construction expected to commence?

The MINISTER OF WATER AFFAIRS:

Mr Chairman, the reply to the question is that the Cabinet decided at its meeting on 29 and 30 November 1988 that a flood attenuation dam shall be constructed on the Klip River just upstream of Ladysmith.

The decision to build a dam for flood attenuation was reached only six months after the Special Cabinet Committee on the Flood Disaster in Natal commissioned a technical subcommittee to find practical solutions for the flooding problem in Ladysmith. Various alternatives were identified, such as payment of future flood damage, relocation of residential and commercial development to higher areas, river bank and channel improvements, administrative control measures and flood attenuation dams. It was ascertained that the proposed Mount Pleasant dam, together with moderate-sized levees on the river banks, will give the greatest protection against future flooding for acceptable cost. For instance the cost of relocation of residential and commercial properties to provide the same protection as that of the dam would be twice as expensive as the dam alternative. I wish to emphasize that the dam will not be the conventional water storage reservoir, but will remain empty most of the time. Storage will only occur during floods.

The commencement of construction hinges around the availability of the special funds which have been allocated for the project. At present funds are available for commencement of construction in the 1991/92 financial year. A period of a year is needed for detailed surveys, geological investigations and design. It is, therefore, possible that the Department of Water Affairs could start construction in the 1990 financial year, and I am examining the rescheduling of funding to achieve an earlier starting date. A White Paper on the project will be tabled in Parliament during the 1990-91 session.

 The MINISTER OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND AGRICULTURE:

Mr Chairman, this seems to be one of the first dams ever to be built in South Africa on the basis of it being an empty dam. I want to know from my hon colleague how many cubic metres of water have to flow through this dam before it reaches flood height and whether this has been based on the principle of the one in 25 year flood plain or the one in a hundred year flood plain?

The amount of money expended for this purpose is appreciated, but could it not also be used for other purposes such as a hydro-electric scheme or perhaps even for the rehabilitation of the wetland areas? Adjoining this area, about thirty kilometres away, is the Draaifontein township. Will this scheme perhaps, even to an extent, assist that township? What is more, I want clarity on whether this dam which is regarded as an “empty” dam … [Time expired.]

 The DEPUTY MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT AFFAIRS:

Mr Chairman, it is a pity that the McEnery Report has not been made public. I have been trying to ascertain whether the report is a document which was confidential up to the time the Cabinet took the decision and we are thus not allowed to reveal what the report stated in its in entirety. Probably if the report were made public it might answer the questions posed by the hon the Minister of Local Government and Agriculture.

I want to place on record the appreciation of the people of Ladysmith for the Cabinet’s support of the McEnery Report on flood control methods. However, I want to appeal to my hon colleague the Minister to expedite the construction of the dams. In particular I want to ask him to assist the people of Ladysmith in implementing these short-term measures—that is the levee banks and the clearing up of the obstruction below the SATS bridge—before the next summer rains. [Time expired.]

 Dr J N REDDY:

Mr Chairman, I am perfectly happy that the hon the Minister has already answered the question on the Order Paper. My purpose was to determine whether, in view of the nature of the disasters and the consequences for the people, priority could have been given to the building of this dam. This is mainly what I wanted to know.

 The MINISTER OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND AGRICULTURE:

Mr Chairman, I did have my say earlier on. I also want to know something else. In the early days a certain Mr Thorington-Smith—who was one of the experts and a renowned personality in planning—was responsible for the planning of the Tugela basin. I would like to know from my hon colleague if any report has been submitted by Mr Thorington-Smith with regard to that particular flood plain area.

 The DEPUTY MINISTER OF ENVIRONMENT AFFAIRS:

Mr Chairman, the effect of these flood control measures is going to be that probably 25% of the town of Ladysmith will be saved from periodic flooding. The floods in Ladysmith have been affecting our people for decades. I can remember a flood some 55 years ago in Ladysmith. Now, at long last, there is a massive injection of funds for the control of floods. I believe this dam—which will be a leaking dam specifically built for the control of flooding in Ladysmith—is a unique dam in South Africa. It is the first of its kind.

On behalf of the people of Ladysmith, I want to reiterate my appreciation to the McEnery Committee, for the work it did in investigating the alleviation of the flooding problems of Ladysmith and to the Cabinet for its support. Without any fear of contradiction, I can tell hon members that the majority of the people of Ladysmith are thrilled by the fact that at long last there is some light at the end of the tunnel for them.

 The MINISTER OF WATER AFFAIRS:

Mr Chairman, I do not think that I will have time to answer all the questions. Actually I can say very little that is not already known. To answer the question of the hon the Minister of Local Government and Agriculture, the carrying capacity of the river is 700 cubic metres per second. The normal flow from the dam will not exceed that. The cost of the whole project is approximately R70 million. That includes the levees and the desilting of the river-bed. We are building a dam that will control a one in a hundred years flood.

To answer my hon colleague, the report is that of my colleague, the hon the Deputy Minister of Agriculture. We will have to discuss the matter with him and decide whether it can be made public.

Yes, we will immediately start on the redesigning and construction of the levees—that is our first priority. The cost involved is approximately R3,7 million. The present design is not good enough.

I now come to the hon member for Glenview. Yes, we are trying to give priority to the matter and we are trying to speed up the process as far as we can.

I think I have given the necessary answers. I am not sure whether a certain Mr Smith was consulted. Mr Chairman, I think that concludes the discussion on the matters that were raised.

Debate concluded.

 Durban: grey areas 2. Mr K CHETTY

asked the Minister of Constitutional Development and Planning:

Whether any areas within the Durban metropolitan area have been identified to be declared so-called grey areas?

 Mr K CHETTY:

Mr Chairman, I withdraw the interpellation printed in my name on the Question Paper.