National Assembly - 27 November 2003
THURSDAY, 27 NOVEMBER 2003 __
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
____
The House met at 14:01.
The Deputy Speaker took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS see col 000.
AIR TICKETS FOR FORMER MEMBERS WHO SERVED FOR FIVE YEARS OR MORE FROM 1994
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Madam Speaker, I move the draft resolution printed in my name on the Order Paper, as follows: That the House, for former members who have served a minimum of five consecutive years in Parliament from 1994 onwards, makes available with effect from 2003 four single air tickets for every year of service up to a maximum of fifteen years, subject to the following conditions:
(1) tickets are for the personal use of the former member and his or her spouse/partner when accompanying the former member;
(2) except for tickets accruing in 2003, which can be rolled over for use in 2004, tickets not used in the year applicable are forfeited; and
(3) tickets are issued for economy class.
Agreed to.
AIR TICKETS FOR FORMER MEMBERS WHO SERVED FOR FIVE YEARS OR MORE BEFORE OR AFTER 1994
(Draft Resolution) The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Madam Speaker, I move the draft resolution printed in my name on the Order Paper, as follows:
That the House -
(1) for former members who have served a minimum of five consecutive years in Parliament in total either before or after 1994, makes available with effect from 2003 four single air tickets for every year of service up to a maximum of fifteen years, subject to the following conditions:
(a) tickets are for the personal use of the former member and his or
her spouse/partner when accompanying the former member;
(b) except for tickets accruing in 2003, which can be rolled over
for use in 2004, tickets not used in the year applicable are
forfeited; and
(c) tickets are issued for economy class; and
(2) resolves to rescind any previous resolution regarding travel facilities for former members.
Agreed to.
EXTENSION OF DATE FOR REPORT BY PORTFOLIO
COMMITTEE ON FINANCE
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Madam Speaker, I move the draft resolution printed in my name on the Order Paper as follows:
That the date by which the Portfolio Committee on Finance is to report to the House in accordance with the resolution adopted on 23 September 2003 on the subject of the financial administration of Parliament with a view to introducing a Bill dealing with the matter, be extended to no later than 28 February 2004. Agreed to.
WOMEN IN CONFLICT SITUATIONS
(Member's Statement)
Ms S D MOTUBATSE-HOUNKPATIN (ANC): Thank you, Deputy Speaker. As we mark the 16 Days of Activism for No Violence Against Women and Children, we also remember women and children all over the world who are in conflict situations.
We remember women in the DRC, Burundi, Rwanda and others who were raped during the conflict and were infected with HIV/Aids. We remember women in Palestine and Israel where children are deprived of their rights to play as children and we call on all peace-loving people to join the international interreligious leaders in their peace efforts to organise a rally in Jerusalem this December.
We urge all communities to join these peace ambassadors to make this prayer rally a success and break the anger and resentment in that region, and contribute to lasting peace. Let the children enjoy their childhood. Let them have a Merry Christmas this year. I thank you. [Applause.]
RACIAL QUOTAS IN POLICE SERVICE
(Member's Statement)
Mr D H M GIBSON (DA): Madam Deputy Speaker, today’s Cape Times states: ``In the interest of equity, 1 000 police posts advertised not for coloured applicants.” [Interjections.] What is going on in South Africa? Are we so contaminated by apartheid that we say to coloured people in the Western Cape: There is no place for you; you are not black enough?
The ANC-New NP coalition here pretends to have the interests of coloured people at heart. How do we justify telling people that racial quotas are more important than ensuring a good competent police force of people who will do the job of fighting crime?
There are 7 000 coloureds, 5 500 whites, 2 200 blacks, and 85 Indian members of the SAPS in the Western Cape. All of this bean counting reminds me of the sickness of apartheid. Are we unable to escape from the past and seek a new future where merit, not colour, is what counts, where opportunities are provided for all, whether people be black or white, Indian or coloured? Can’t we move to a South Africa where we say to coloureds and everyone else: You belong; you are part of the rainbow nation? [Applause.]
BY-ELECTION IN UKHAHLAMBA
(Member's Statement)
Ms M M MDLALOSE (IFP): Madam Speaker, yesterday there was a by-election in Ward 12, uKhahlamba, which is in the uThukela District in the province of KwaZulu-Natal. The IFP won the by-election with 61% of the votes - mark you, 61% of the votes - followed by the ANC with 23% and the ACDP with 16%. The big victory of the IFP is a clear indication that voters have full confidence in the IFP. We wish to congratulate Councillor Bonginkosi Khuzwayo, who was elected and wish him well in his endeavour to serve the people of ward 12, uKhahlamba. This is only the beginning. [Interjections.] [Laughter.] [Applause.]
MIDRAND CONSTITUENCY
(Member's Statement)
Ms F HAJAIG (ANC): Thank you, Madam Speaker. The constituency of Midrand comprises a large area between the cities of Johannesburg and Pretoria. It is a complex area comprising an industrial hub, middle-class residential areas, impoverished townships like Ivory Park, Ebony Park and Rabie, and informal settlements like Kanana.
Despite all the problems facing our indigent communities, the programme of visiting our schools has paid off, because the Eqinisweni High School in Ivory Park was voted number one in the Gauteng province.
To deal with unemployment and the challenge of poverty, two workshops were organised with the Department of Trade and Industry officials who were invited to explain to the overflowing hall full of people what programmes were offered to promote entrepreneurship within the small, medium and micro business programme. Officials of the Departments of Labour and Social Development came to report back and answer questions put to them by our people.
On a rotating basis, all clinics in the area are provided with food parcels, blankets and clothing for HIV-positive and TB patients. People’s problems concerning municipal services are directed immediately to the various councillors so that relief can be speedily negotiated.
Houses are being built on an ongoing basis covering the bare fields that existed before. The PCO has played a meaningful role in mobilising our youth to register and encouraging voters to check their names on the voter’s roll. Much has been done, much remains to be done, but we are on our way to a better life. Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.] ROAD SAFETY
(Member's Statement)
Mr J DURAND (New NP): Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker.
Tydens verlede jaar se feesseisoen het 1 882 mense in ongelukke op Suid- Afrikaanse paaie gesterf. Ons kan nie ‘n herhaling van so ‘n slagting hierdie jaar op ons paaie toelaat nie. [During last year’s festive season 1 882 people died in accidents on South African roads. We cannot allow a repetition of such a massacre on our roads this year.]
The New NP has raised its concern with regard to road safety on various occasions. The recent spate of accidents involving trucks and buses shows that the enforcement of traffic laws and regulations must be a priority if we want to end the unacceptably high number of fatal accidents on our roads. Among the reasons for the accidents were overloading, driver fatigue, unroadworthy trucks and drunk driving, all of which could have been prevented.
Daarom verwelkom die Nuwe NP die onlangse maatreëls wat die Minister aangekondig het ten opsigte van swaar voertuie. Daar moet egter toegesien word dat dié maatreëls streng nagevolg word, anders baat dit niks. [The New NP therefore welcomes the recent measures relating to heavy vehicles announced by the Minister. However, these measures must be strictly enforced, otherwise they will serve no purpose.]
There are currently about six million licensed drivers on our roads; we want to call on all motorists to be responsible and comply with the traffic rules. Road safety is everyone’s priority, especially over the festive season when the number of cars on our roads will double. The New NP pledges its support to the Arrive Alive campaign. Let us all arrive alive at our destinations. I thank you.
RECENT BY-ELECTIONS
(Member's Statement)
Mnr P J GROENEWALD (VF): Agb Adjunkspeaker, die Vryheidsfront Plus het vandag sterk groei getoon in al die plaaslike bestuurstussenverkiesings waaraan dié party deelgeneem het. Dit sluit in ‘n goeie oorwinning oor die DA in Bloemfontein en ‘n stewige tweede plek ná die DA in Randfontein. Daarteenoor het die steun vir die DA beduidend gedaal in die Bloemfonteinse tussenverkiesing, wat die VF onlangs gewen het, asook in die twee plaaslike tussenverkiesings wat gister in Uitenhage en in Randfontein gehou is.
In die DA-setel in Randfontein het die VF Plus gister 535 stemme behaal. Dit beteken dat in Randfontein die DA se hoeveelheid stemme van 72% in 2000 na 47% gister gedaal het. Die daling in DA-stemme kan daaraan toegeskryf word dat ‘n beduidende hoeveelheid Afrikaanssprekende stemme hul rug op die DA draai en nou vir die Vryheidsfront Plus stem. [Tussenwerpsels.] Die oneerlike politiek wat die DA tydens verkiesings gebruik, sal in die toekoms steeds meer op hulle boemerang. Die misbruik van verstandelike gestremdes tydens die verkiesing deur die DA is ‘n skande.
Die VF Plus ondersoek tans ook ‘n oortreding van die Kieswet deur die DA oor ‘n pamflet wat gister, op stemdag, versprei is. Die pamflet het die kiesers met leuens mislei oor die sogenaamde steun wat partye op daardie tydstip van die stemdag sou hê. Die feite was presies die teenoorgestelde van dít wat die pamflet beweer het. Kiesers het hierná by die Vryheidsfront Plus om verskoning kom vra, dat hul eers hierdie krisis moet help oplos deur DA te stem, hoewel hulle eintlik Vryheidsfront Plus ondersteuners is. Die Vryheidsfront Plus ondersoek tans hoe ver dié tipe propaganda die Kieswet oortree. [Tussenwerpsels.] [Tyd verstreke.] (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)
[Mr P J GROENEWALD (FF): Hon Deputy Speaker, the Freedom Front Plus has shown significant growth today in all the local government by-elections in which this party participated. This includes a good victory over the DA in Bloemfontein and a strong second place after the DA in Randfontein. In contrast support for the DA decreased significantly in the Bloemfontein by- election, which the FF won recently, as well as in the two local by- elections which were held in Uitenhage and Randfontein yesterday.
In the DA seat in Randfontein the FF Plus polled 535 votes yesterday. This means that in Randfontein the DA’s number of votes decreased from 72% in 2000 to 47% yesterday. The decrease in the number of DA votes can be ascribed to the fact that a significant number of Afrikaans-speaking voters have turned their back on the DA and are now voting for the Freedom Front Plus. [Interjections.] The dishonest politics used by the DA during elections will backfire on them to an increasing extent in the future. The abuse of the mentally disabled by the DA during the election is a disgrace.
The FF Plus is at present also investigating a contravention of the Electoral Act by the DA regarding a pamphlet that was distributed yesterday, on polling day. The pamphlet misled the voters with lies about the so-called support which parties enjoyed at that stage of the polling day. The facts were the exact opposite of those given in the pamphlet. Afterwards voters came to apologise to the Freedom Front Plus, saying that they first had to help to resolve this crisis by voting DA, although they were in fact Freedom Front Plus supporters. The Freedom Front Plus is at present investigating to what extent this type of propaganda contravenes the Electoral Act. [Interjections.] [Time expired.]]
PROVISION OF ANTIRETOVIRALS IN THE PUBLIC HEALTH SECTOR
(Member's Statement)
Ms S H NTOMBELA (ANC): Madam Speaker, the ANC welcomes the decision taken by Cabinet on Wednesday, 19 November 2003, to adopt the detailed operational plan for the provision of antiretroviral treatment in the public health sector. This decision has gained the South African Government applause from the international community. This plan will strengthen the Government’s very comprehensive five-year strategy adopted in 2002.
As the ANC we commend Government’s approach on this matter as it has consistently sought to ensure that our response to HIV/Aids is driven by our people’s needs and by considerations of affordability, sustainability, and the best scientific information available.
We further commend the Government for handling this serious matter facing our people in a responsible manner, refusing to yield to opportunistic pressures from those who seek to score political points, even at the expense of the lives of our people.
Since there is still no cure for HIV/Aids, let us continue doing everything humanly possible to ensure that prevention remains at the centre of our strategy. Let us care, and treat opportunistic infections and create greater social awareness. Let us strengthen the partnership of hope. I thank you. [Applause.]
CRIME IN KWAZULU-NATAL
(Member's Statement)
Miss S RAJBALLY (MF): Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Noting the seriousness of crime in KwaZulu-Natal, the MF is pleased and expresses its gratitude to the SA Police Service for working closely with the community- based committees in striving to combat crime in KZN.
Crime, however, remains a major challenge, and the MF hopes that the involvement of the Department of Safety and Security will assist in making KZN a safer place to live in. The statistics on crime in KZN are scary and living in fear of losing your life is common. We need to strengthen our fight against crime.
The determination of communities and the SAPS to stamp out crime is intense, but minimal resources hinder this achievement. It is greatly hoped that the Budget of this year will assist the supply of resources being made available to the SAPS. The protection of our people is our constitutional duty.
We thank the department for all it has done thus far, and I am confident that with the department’s concerned attention, safety and security will prevail. Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker.
CASTRATION FOR RAPISTS
(Member's Statement)
Ms T E MILLIN (IAM): Thank you, Madam Speaker. Against the background of the 16-day campaign of activism against woman and child abuse, media reports yesterday noted that Zambia - where 400 known child rapes have occurred during the first half of 2003, a 68% increase from the same period in 2002 - is considering castrating rapists. MPs in Zambia are giving this arguably barbaric method their approval as a deterrent to the far more barbaric act of child rape, allowing the proposal to go to their cabinet for consideration.
The IAM would support similar legislation here in order to deter the incidence of woman and child rape, as this form of punishment - castration
-
would not only reduce the pressure of overcrowded prison populations, but would also obviate the current 80% repeat rate by offenders. Therefore, such legislation would provide a meaningful contribution to the current campaign of no violence against women and children, and promote a safer and better life for all. Viva South Africa!
IMBIZO IN MPUMALANGA (Member's Statement)
Mr P M MATHEBE (ANC): Deputy Speaker, as part of the ANC Government’s commitment to deepening democracy, good governance and accountability through consultation and accessibility, the Deputy President attended an imbizo in Mpumalanga on 17 and 18 November 2003. This imbizo successfully brought together the people of our rural and urban areas - different communities of faith, youth, women and traditional leaders of our province.
It was indeed people’s power in action when the people of Umkomaaz and Moretele asked the Deputy President questions about the shortage of water, the slow pace of the process of finalising land claims, unemployment, and the lack of institutions of higher learning in the area.
The people thanked Government for working with them in housing delivery and for all the efforts the Government is making in alleviating poverty. To further emphasise the confidence that the people of the area have in the ANC-led Government, the by-election held on 26 November 2003 in Delmas Rot was overwhelmingly won by the ANC. The results were as follows: ANC - 79%; UDM - 14%; PAC - 5%; IFP - only 2%. I thank you. [Applause.]
BY-ELECTIONS RESULTS
(Member's Statement) Mnr T D LEE (DA): Adjunkspeaker, die DA het gister al drie sy setels in tussenverkiesings behou. Hy het ook by verstek in die Noord-Kaapse munisipaliteit, Renosterberg, 'n setel by die ANC afgeneem.
In Randfontein, wat voorheen as Mulder-wêreld bekend gestaan het, het die DA 48% van die stemme gekry, die VF Plus 30%, die ANC 21%, en die ACDP 0,6%. Dit is Dr Boy Geldenhuys se kiesafdeling, maar die Nuwe NP het nie eens gestaan nie.
In Kimberley het die DA 97% van die stemme gekry en die ANC 3%. In Uitenhage het die DA 54%, die ANC 39%, die NA 6% en die PAC 0,8% van die stemme gekry.
Afrikaanssprekende kiesers in tradisioneel konserwatiewe gebiede het die separatistiese en rassistiese agenda van die regse vleuel uitdruklik verwerp … [Tussenwerpsels.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Mr T D LEE (DA): Deputy Speaker, the DA retained retained seats it already held in three by-elections yesterday. By default, it also took a seat from the ANC in the Northern Cape municipality of Renosterberg.
In Randfontein, which was formerly known as Mulder country, the DA polled 48% of the votes, the FF Plus 30%, the ANC 21% and the ACDP 0,6%. It is Dr Boy Geldenhuy’s constituency, but the New NP did not even contest the election.
In Kimberley the DA polled 97% of the votes and the ANC 3%. In Uitenhage the DA polled 54%, the ANC 39%, the NA 6% and the PAC 0,8%.
Afrikaans-speaking voters in traditionally conservative areas have emphatically rejected the separatist and racist agenda of the right wing … [Interjections.]]
Mr L M GREEN (ACDP): I rise on a point of order, Deputy Speaker. The quotation, or the statistics given by the hon member … [Interjections.] No, I just want to ask him something. He says ACDP something per cent. Isn’t it perhaps CDP? I am sure he’s referring to the CDP.
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: No, hon member. The hon member can look at the correctness of the details of his statement. Please finish your statement, hon member.
Mnr T D LEE (DA): Afrikaanssprekende kiesers in tradisioneel konserwatiewe gebiede het die separatistiese en rassistiese agenda van die regse vleuel uitdruklik verwerp ten gunste van die DA se benadering, wat ‘n nie-rassige alternatief vir die ANC wil bou. Die ANC moet nou weet dat wanneer hy die Vryheidsfront vlei en paai hy hom vereenselwig met ‘n party wat in wese rassisties bly. [Tyd verstreke.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[Mr T D LEE (DA): Afrikaans-speaking voters in traditionally conservative areas have emphatically rejected the separatist and racist agenda of the right wing in favour of the DA’s approach, who wants to build a non-racial alternative to the ANC. The ANC must now realise that when it flatters and appeases the Freedom Front, it is associating with a party which essentially remains racist. [Time expired.]]
MEMBERS' GYM FACILITIES
(Member's Statement)
Dr R RABINOWITZ (IFP): Madam Deputy Speaker, the wheels of Parliament sometimes turn quickly, and sometimes slowly, but we must rejoice - even as opposition parties - that they do turn and that we help them to do so.
At the beginning of the second democratic parliamentary session, imbued with the desire to see through a healthy term, I appealed to the hon Speaker to give members gym facilities and an exercise space in which to do yoga, pilates and aerobics, and to get dietary advice. What we had was old, cold, dark and always locked. It cried out for transformation. The matter was taken forward by the IFP Chief Whip and by the Members’ Support Committee. This week I investigated the state of the gyms. They are still locked and unusable, but revamped, and by next year we will have a state-of-the-art gym open for members to pump up muscles and push up heart rates.
May we hope that by the time the third parliamentary session ends, members will also have a pleasant space with a view of blue sky and green trees in which to practise yoga, pilates and aerobics.
On behalf of the IFP, I wish members a happy and healthy holiday. May you all drive safely, dine well, and don’t let the election stomp give you leg cramps or headaches. Thank you.
BY-ELECTION IN KWANDENGEZI
(Member's Statement)
Nk M N OLIPHANT (ANC): Phini likaSomlomo, singuKhongolose siyabonga siyanconcoza ngesenzo esenziwe ngoNgqongqoshe baka-ANC KwaZulu-Natali sokuthi babambisane ekulweni nobubha ukuze ikati lingalali eziko. Ngikhuluma nje ngenyanga ephelile bethule uhlelo lomsebenzi womphakathi oluzobiza isigidi esingu-R1,2 endaweni yasoBuka. Lokhu kukhombisa ukuthi inqubo yokuthuthukisa umphakathi ngokuhlanganyela, ebizwa nge-IDP, iyasebenza.
Konke lokhu kuyinkomba yokuthi uKhongolose uzimisele ukulwa nobubha nokwenza izimpilo zabantu baseMzansi Afrika zibe ngcono, ngaphandle kokubukela ubuqembu bezepolitiki. Ngakho sinxusa bonke abantu bakuleli zwe ukuba babambisane noKhongolose ekwakheni kabusha leli zwe ukuze izimpilo zabo zibe ngcono.
Lokhu kwenze ukuthi okhethweni lwayizolo obelukuWodi 12, KwaNdengezi, kumasipala waseThekwini kuphumelele uKhongolose ngamavoti angu-1 901, i-IFP yona ithole amavoti awu-264 kuphela, kanti i-ACDP ayitholanga ngisho elilodwa ivoti. Lokhu kukhombisa ukuthi uKhongolose uwine ngo-85% kwiwodi. [Ihlombe.] Ngakho sibongela uKhansela uNgcobo ngokunqoba ukhetho. Sithi halala Khongolose, halala!
AMALUNGU AHLONIPHEKILE: Halala! (Translation of Zulu member’s statement follows.)
[Ms M N OLIPHANT: Deputy Speaker, as the ANC we are grateful for a job well done by the KwaZulu-Natal MECs in working together to fight poverty so that people are able to overcome hunger. Even as I speak, last month they introduced a community work programme, which will cost R1,2 million in the area of oBuka. This indicates that the programme of developing the community together, which is called the IDP, is working.
All this is an indication that the Congress is determined to fight poverty to make the lives of the people of South Africa better, without looking at party politics. We therefore appeal to all the people of this country to work with the Congress in rebuilding this country so that their lives may become better.
This resulted in the Congress polling 1 901 votes, the IFP only 264 votes, while the ACDP did not poll a single vote in yesterday’s election, which was held in Ward 12, KwaNdengezi, in the eThekwini municipality. This indicates that the Congress won by 85% in the Ward. [Applause.] We therefore congratulate Councillor Ngcobo on winning the election. We say congratulations Congress, congratulations!
HON MEMBERS: Congratulations!]
DIFFICULTIES POLICEMAN IS HAVING IN PASSING HORSERIDING COURSE AND
OBTAINING DRIVER'S LICENCE
(Member's Statement)
Mnr A Z A VAN JAARSVELD (Nuwe NP): Adjunkspeaker, vir ‘n bevelvoerder van die polisie se Veediefstaleenheid op Wepener het die uitdrukking om ‘n verkeerde perd op te saal nuwe betekenis gekry, aangesien hy sy perdrykursus gedruip het. Dit lyk of hy sy rybewystoets ook eers gaan slaag as die perde horings kry, want hy probeer blykbaar nou al sedert 1982 om sy voertuigrybewys te kry.
Die Nuwe NP wil ‘n beroep doen op die Minister om die moontlikheid te ondersoek om vir dié kaptein ‘n fiets aan te skaf en om ook te onthou ‘n donkie is ‘n wonderlike ding. Indien dit nie moontlik is nie, wil ons darem net vir dié bevelvoerder sê: “Ou perd, hou moed”. Onthou, met dapper en stapper bereik ‘n mens darem ook jou bestemming.
In die gees van “ou ryperd, ons ry die pad tesame” wil die Nuwe NP die Minister van Arbeid versoek om geld uit die Vaardigheidsheffingsfonds aan sy kabinetskollega beskikbaar te stel vir spesiale perdryvaardigheidsopleiding vir hierdie kaptein, anders gaan hy gedurig die kar voor die perde span in sy pogings om misdadigers te vang. Baie dankie. (Translation of Afrikaans member’s statement follows.)
[Mr A Z A VAN JAARSVELD (New NP): Deputy Speaker, for a commanding officer of the Stock Theft Unit of the police in Wepener the expression “backing the wrong horse” took on a new meaning, because he failed his horseriding course. By all accounts he is also only going to pass his driver’s licence test when horses sprout wings, because he has apparently been trying to obtain his driver’s licence since 1982.
The New NP wants to appeal to the Minister to investigate the possibility of acquiring a bicycle for this captain and also not to forget that a donkey is a wonderful thing. If this is not possible, we would at least like to say to this commanding officer: Don’t despair. Remember, one can also reach one’s destination on foot.
In the spirit of “ou ryperd, ons ry die pad tesame” [old horse, we take on the road together] the New NP wants to request the Minister of Labour to make money available from the Skills Development Fund to his Cabinet colleague for special horseriding skills training for this captain, otherwise he will constantly be putting the cart before the horses in his efforts to apprehend criminals. Thank you very much.] TRANSFORMATION OF HIGHER EDUCATION
(Statement)
The MINISTER OF EDUCATION: Madam Deputy Speaker, with your permission, I greet the Vice Chancellor of the National University of Ireland at Galway, which recently conferred an honorary degree on Mr Nelson Mandela.
Madam Speaker, you will recall that I made a promise to this House, some time ago, that I would report to you on the implementation of this Government’s programme for the transformation of higher education. I am therefore before you this afternoon to honour my undertaking.
I can think of few better ways to end an eventful year, both for this House and education, and a very productive year, than to inform you of the significant progress that we are making towards the realisation of the goal of a transformed higher education system that the nation can truly own and truly be proud of. It is no exaggeration to claim that we are making history. Indeed, we are on the eve of the birth of four new institutions which we established through the merger of existing institutions on 1 January 2004. These are: the University of KwaZulu-Natal from the merger of the University of Natal and the University of Durban-Westville; the North West University from the merger of the University of Potchefstroom and the University of the North West; the Tshwane University of Technology from the merger of Pretoria Technikon, Technikon Northern Gauteng and Technikon North West; and the new University of South Africa from the merger of Unisa and Technikon South Africa and the Vudek component of Vista University.
In January 2005, five more institutions will be established: the Cape Peninsula University of Technology - the Minister of Finance shouldn’t say anything rude - the University of Johannesburg, the Nelson Mandela Metropolitan University in Port Elizabeth, the University of Limpopo and the Walter Sisulu University of Technology and Science in the Eastern Cape. There can be no doubt that the higher education landscape is well on its way to reflecting the values, the ethos and the aspirations of our democracy, away from the false divisions and the low standards of the apartheid past, which have, for far too long, scarred our higher education system, and limited its ability to truly respond to the current and future needs of our country and our democracy.
These new beginnings that we are witnessing are possible because of the commitment of this Government to building an efficient, effective, fair and equitable higher education system that is able to meet the country’s needs in terms of high level human resources, including the professionals needed to drive key sectors in the economy and those who will support the provision of social, health and education services to improve the quality of life of all our citizens. The new system will also nurture the coming generations’ intellectuals, especially black and women researchers and scholars who should play a critically important role in the maturing of our democracy.
Let me assure you that our commitment to a new vision for higher education is matched by the resources necessary for implementation. You may recall the recent mid-term Budget statement of the Minister of Finance a few days ago in which he reiterated the Government’s commitment to funding the institutional reconstruction of the system.
Over the next three to five years R3 billion rands will be invested in this restructuring process. This is an investment in the coming generation of students and staff who will benefit from higher education. Equally, it’s an investment in the future social, economic and political wellbeing of our country. I would like to thank my colleague Minister Manuel and his department for their confidence in our ability and capacity to restructure and reshape our universities and technikons.
The transformation of higher education has been very long in the making. Since the early nineties, many studies, commissions and inquiries have informed our thinking. Here I need to single out the ANC which, nearly 10 years ago, with remarkable prescience, in the midst of struggle, produced an extraordinary document entitled A policy framework for education and training or, as it’s affectionately known, ``the yellow book’’, which has nothing to do with a lack of backbone; it’s just the impressive colour that they use. The yellow book has guided our efforts in transforming the entire education system.
So, in the context of higher education, it called on us to transform the system for the development of policy ``aimed at economic growth, the enhancement of democratic political system, promotion of the cultural and intellectual life of our society’’. As I mentioned earlier, this is precisely what we are trying to achieve, viz to carry out this remarkable mandate of 10 years ago.
I would like to express my deep appreciation to the many men and women who have contributed to the rich body of work that has shaped our change agenda. It would also be remiss of me if I did not acknowledge the role played by generations of students and staff activists whose struggles and sacrifices have helped us to achieve our dreams.
Let us remember the martyrs of 1976 and the students who lost their lives in the campus strife in the dark days of the 1980s in the state of emergency as well as the leadership and rank and file of the national student organisations such as the South African Students Organisation, Saso, the Azanian Students Organisation, Azaso, the National Union of South African Students, Nusas, the cadres of the National Education Co-ordinating Committee, the South African National Students Congress, Sansco, and the South African Students Congress.
I’m also reminded of the tragic and untimely death of Dr Kgomotso Maseba- Langa, the first secretary-general of Sansco, who was gunned down only a few days ago. There are great patriots - Jack Simon, Roy Hoffenberg, Rick Turner and David Webster - who fought for real academic freedom. While the others remained silent and made their peace with the socio and military system of apartheid, these patriots will always be remembered for their tremendous contributions to the vitality and life of our universities.
Closer to this House, the role of the Portfolio Committee on Education must be acknowledged. The committee, under the exceptional leadership of Blade Nzimande laid the policy and legislative foundation for the post-1994 transformation of higher education.
The transformation of our higher education system has been and will continue to be an extremely challenging task. It is one that requires us to balance different interests and needs. However, I can confidently say that it is informed by a set of principles that are articulated in the White Paper of 1997, entitled ``A programme for the transformation of higher education’’, and these principles are obviously not negotiable, because they’ve been accepted by this Government and this House.
Amongst these principles are a commitment to equity and redress, democratisation, development, quality enhancement, effectiveness and efficiency, academic freedom and public accountability. The very ways in which we give effect to these principles have shaped the unfolding of the new system. It is a higher education system that is rooted in the realities of our society. Put differently, it is a higher education system for South Africa and of South Africa.
It has been suggested by Malegapuru Makgoba and Sipho Seepe that ``the central issue for universities today is an institutional transformation in higher education that will provide for the production of knowledge, recognises the African condition as historical and defines the key task as one of coming to grips with it critically’’. It is my vision that all of our universities should be responsive to and embracing of the national reconstruction and development agenda through the core work of teaching, research and community service.
This approach enjoys wide support both locally and internationally. As is stated in the executive summary of the Association of Commonwealth Universities, entitled ``Engagement as a core value for the university in 2001’’:
The world depends increasingly on universities for knowledge, prosperity and policy-thinking. Universities are thus required to become engines of development for people, for institutions and democracy in general. Engagement defines the whole orientation and tone of a university’s policy and practice. Mission statements, strategic planning, teaching and learning policies, and research directions must evince and encourage active respect for the concerns and challenges faced by society.
This is particularly important as we leave the old order. As we begin to develop the new order, the sense of the engagement by higher education must be right in the centre of our tasks.
Such critical engagement between universities and the societies within which they are located hardly translates into subservience of the academy to either the market or national political agendas, as some analysts seem to suggest. In fact, South Africa leads the world in ensuring that the World Trade Organisation’s approach of assimilating education as a service, as a commodity and commercialising higher education goes against the fundamental ideas that we hold very dear, and there is reconstruction and development.
In other words, the market cannot determine the needs of higher education and the needs of our people. It is important to remember, therefore, that South Africa began the international debate as to how the World Trade Organisation Uruguay round assimilated education, particularly training, and higher education to service for which there’ll be free movement between the countries.
We offer free movement to one country, then the most favoured nation clause wants to offer it to everyone. Therefore, South Africa will be opened as a source of profit, not as a service to higher education. South Africa will become a source of profit for the world, and the world largely means those countries that do not invest in South Africa through direct investment will undoubtedly invest in education and training.
So, let me make it clear that there will continue to be space in our higher education institutions for all forms of enquiry, including the so-called pure and applied research. As Minister, I have always tried to maintain a balance between pure and applied research both in the arts and humanities, and especially in the sciences.
Teaching and learning must be in the full spectrum of academic as well as career-focused disciplines and fees. The important thing is that as we enter this period of great imaginative thinking, our higher education institutions must be receptive, as they are in the rest of the world. As the Vice Chancellor of the National University of Ireland will tell you, Galway, 20 years ago, was an institution without a future. Now, because of the investment in science and technology, in language and in arts, Galway is one of the most thriving universities in the whole of Europe.
The state will continue to invest. Part of that investment must be a recognition that the universities must be receptive to the needs - the intellectual, the moral and ethical needs - of our society. We are committed to promoting diversity in institutional arrangements in higher education. We will not be bullied into uniform and one-dimensional perspectives on what constitutes a university. It must be a multidimensional approach.
A hallmark of the new system should, however, be a commitment to quality in every aspect of the academic project, be it teaching, research, community service or in the administration, management and governance of universities. We simply cannot be complacent when it comes to quality. Our students deserve, hon members from all parts of this House, the very best in teaching and research that our country can afford, and should be given the opportunity to grow through a quality higher education experience, which should not be marred by prejudice or poverty.
There is much that Government can do to provide the policy and legislative frameworks for the transformation of higher education. We can also endeavour to resource the sector properly and to put into place the planning and quality assurance mechanisms, as we’ve done, required to steer the system. However, much of the outcomes will be shaped and determined by the leadership of our higher education institutions, the councils, the vice chancellors and the student bodies.
I am pleased to report that the councils and vice chancellors of most of our universities have embraced the challenges of transformation with much energy, enthusiasm and insight. I am most grateful for their commitment and support in this period of transition, because no country has had our history. No country has therefore tried to renew, restructure and transform.
In conclusion, I would like to thank you for the privilege of briefing you this afternoon on an area of education which I know is of considerable interest to this House. However, for those of you who think that everything is now settled, that we have finished with this task, let me leave you with the powerful words of the Nigerian poet, Ben Okri, who reminds us that:
They are only the exhausted who think that they have arrived at the final destination, the end of the road with all their dreams achieved, and no new dreams to hold.
We have many dreams which are still with us. We hold them very dear. With your assistance, we will fulfil them for the reconstruction of our higher education system. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Mr M H STEELE: Madam Speaker, hon Minister, the higher education sector of this country, as is the case in most countries, often attracts political debate which is proportionately greater than its budget or the percentage of the population that it engages. There are good reasons for this disproportionate emphasis. The institutions themselves, whether they are traditional universities or the new universities of technology, are the physical embodiments of intellectual capital, nurturing the minds that will produce the theoretical breakthroughs of the future. They also produce employable graduates with valuable skills and every skilled worker supports the jobs of many who are unskilled.
To establish power and control over a higher education sector is a struggle for any government. Judging by the hon Minister’s statement, he now feels able to congratulate himself on having achieved a measure of this control.
The Minister has reflected on some of the battles of the past, and specifically on the tragic events of Soweto, 1976. It was a classic example of the folly of trying to impose, by force and bureaucratic edict, an education policy on an unwilling population. But 1976, decisive as it may have been for the future of apartheid, was not the beginning of the clashes between the state and the higher education sector.
The grossly misnamed Extension of Universities Act, which the former NP passed on the universities during the 1950s and 60s, brought a passionate reaction from particularly the English-speaking institutions. The imposition of racial quotas and the denial of access of black students to the previously open universities was bitterly resented. It was opposed by staff and students of the day as a flagrant assault on their academic freedom and was the crudest form of racial discrimination.
Some of the issues that were foremost in the debate then are still with us today. These are issues such as centralist control, academic and institutional autonomy, racial equity and justice.
The Minister is expansive on those issues which are dear to his heart, particularly the changes which have resulted from institutional mergers. I suspect that the Minister is a statist at heart, and he must be very satisfied that the directives that have flowed from his Ministry have seen newly compounded institutions come into being all over the country. We have to ask whether these mergers were ever primarily about delivering a better quality of education to larger numbers of students or whether their primary goal was not simply about greater centralised control.
Have these mergers produced greater capacity for improved teaching and research or merely greater compliance? Have the new institutions the same credibility among students and the wider public which their predecessors enjoyed? I note that the Minister is silent on issues such as these in his statement. For example, the Universities of Durban-Westville and Natal have been anything but enthusiastic partners. The merging of these two fiercely independent universities has been accompanied by much controversy. I suspect it has left a legacy of future mistrust.
The Minister can hardly be satisfied with the events at Durban-Westville that led him to dispatch his own external assessor to investigate. The new University of the North West has also come into being over a legacy of unhappiness. Some former alumni of Potchefstroom University are rightly concerned over the loss of their former university’s character while students of the former University of Bophuthatswana/North West have protested at possible fee increases. [Interjections.] It was, originally.
This would have been a glorious opportunity for the Minister to make an unequivocal declaration preserving the status of Afrikaans as a medium of instruction and dominant culture in at least two of the former Afrikaans- medium universities. But allowing for this kind of autonomy, diversity and independence is not the style of the current Ministry. We look forward to hearing how the union of Unisa, Vista and Technikon RSA has resulted in the decentralised delivery of quality distance education.
The Minister is also silent about the need of the higher education sector to continue expanding. We see that the Minister is now not so optimistic about the massification that was talked about in February 2001. The Minister could also have congratulated many of the country’s universities on the extent to which they have already transformed themselves. Pretoria, Wits and UCT now all have more than 30% black enrolments.
We prefer to see a commitment to identifying talent and potential that exists across all our communities. We prefer merit to be the only criterion for success and for academic selection. We welcome the Minister’s commitment to academic and institutional quality. The Minister may not like to acknowledge it, but the academic enterprise is a classic example of the free market, the market of ideas.
I hope the Minister will also welcome the inevitable challenge to the current orthodoxy that will come from the higher education institutions. Academics and students will never refrain from critique of any established status quo and even the policies of the ruling party will be ruthlessly evaluated. The right to dissent is as alive today as it was in the 60s and 70s. Our Minister should be encouraging the kind of creativity and critique that only independent and autonomous institutions can produce. Thank you. [Applause.]
Prince N E ZULU: Deputy Speaker, our country has undergone a metamorphosis in many respects in order to undo what the apartheid regime did in this country. We have seen Government bodies replacing school committees; we have seen learners having representative councils; we have seen learners accessing schools that were like ivory towers in which resources were never a problem compared to the previously disadvantaged schools.
Higher education has been one of the areas in education which one would not dare tamper with because it has been an environment in which intellectual power was used to perpetuate political and economic power for a select few. Of course, there have been zealous efforts from the previously disadvantaged institutions to empower the African masses for the metamorphosis we are still undergoing as a country.
Most of us are where we are today because of these institutions, deprived of resources as they were. Today, in each day, we hope for a better present and the very best for the future. Transformation is not a stroke-of-the-pen issue; humans will always be involved since transformation is for the people by the people.
As we transform higher education, we realise that these institutions have a culture each one has engendered and adopted over the years. It could be an administrative culture, academic culture, admission culture, etc. In the light of these issues, we should at all costs try to accommodate students that have been victims of the old order who cannot move at a fast pace to catch up with the intricacies of a sophisticated and well-resourced learning environment, an environment that has also not thought of the weakness of someone different as a normal weakness but as a malady. These students must not be made to feel that they do not belong at those institutions in the first place. They should feel that transformation is also embracing them in their structural weakness. There must be academic efforts to make them cope with the situation. Also, Mr Minister, we would like to appeal that the restructuring process should not hugely victimise African academics, as this will create problems and the end will not justify the means. Everybody, especially those who were on the receiving end, should feel that transformation has brought them some if not substantial good.
The IFP supports the transformation process. I thank you.
Mrs M E OLCKERS: Deputy Speaker, the New NP wishes to congratulate the various educational institutions on reaching agreement on a great number of issues in the process of their respective mergers into a single institution.
This has been a give-and-take debate and it is proof of the practical goodwill that exists in our country. This process was started in the early 1990s and, after many studies, commissions, debates, etc, we have today the realisation of the idea that started back in 1990.
The New NP calls on these institutions of higher education to live up to the proud record that some of these institutions built up over the past years, so that the students who leave with their qualifications may realise that as far as excellence is concerned they can compete equally with the rest of the world.
As the hon Minister has said, much of the outcome will be shaped and determined by the leadership of our higher education institutions. We call on leadership, but especially the New NP calls on the students too, to conduct themselves with dedication and discipline, because they are a fortunate group of people to have the chance to further their studies. I thank you.
Ms C DUDLEY: Deputy Speaker, the ACDP supports positive transformation and recognises the difficulties and challenges involved. A letter from a student in KwaZulu-Natal highlights some of the challenges they faced from a student’s perspective. She writes:
I have been a student at the University of Natal for four years, this year completing my honours degree. Details for the event have been scant. A facade has been constructed around the involvement of students and their opinions. When questions and queries have been raised, they have been met with blank nods and promises of “we’ll see”.
Little consideration has been afforded the students during this period. Lecturers and professors who sit on various merger meetings are continuously called to emergency meetings. We are then told at the last minute that lectures or seminars have been postponed or cancelled. Both students and lecturers have had to organise periods outside of their regular timetable to ensure completion of the work. Semester dates, graduation dates and exam dates have been adjusted outside consultation. When problems have arisen as a result, little has been done to help.
Now, at the time of writing they were about to write supplementary exams and were faced with the possibility of graduating from a university with no name. They were very pleased that there was now a name.
The ACDP would like to remind the hon Minister of the importance of the responsibility that he has to see that student politics on campus are managed properly to ensure that violence and intimidation do not enjoy free reign, and we wish him all the best. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mnr P J GROENEWALD: Agb mevrou die Adjunkspeaker, die agb Minister kom en hy sê dat as ons kyk na ons akademiese instellings, dan moet dit instellings wees van intellek, morele waardes, hoë akademiese standaarde en gehalte.
Ek wil vir die agb Minister sê die VF Plus stem 100% saam dat dit behoort te wees hoe ons akademiese instellings daar moet uitsien. Ek wil egter ook vir die agb Minister sê hy moet dan nie toelaat dat sy politieke onderrok uithang nie, want ‘n verskuilde agenda is baie duidelik by die agb Minister te bespeur, wat daarop dui dat hy wil sien dat daar nie ‘n Afrikaanse akademiese instelling moet wees met Afrikaans as medium van onderrig nie.
As ‘n oudstudent van die Potchefstroomse universiteit wil ek vir die agb Minister sê die rektor skuil agter die rok van die agb Minister deur vir die mense te sê dit is die Minister wat so besluit het en hulle het geen keuse gehad nie. Dit is wat daar buite gesê word en die agb Minister moet kennis neem daarvan. Dankie. [Tussenwerpsels.] (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)
[Mr P J GROENEWALD: Hon Madam Deputy Speaker, the hon Minister comes along and he says that when we look at our academic institutions, they must be institutions of intellect, moral values, high academic standards and quality.
I want to tell the hon Minister that the FF Plus agrees whole-heartedly that this is what our academic institutions should be like. However, I also want to tell the hon Minister that he should not let his political slip show, because it is quite clear that the Minister has a hidden agenda, which indicates that he wants to ensure that there is not a single Afrikaans academic institution with Afrikaans as its medium of instruction.
As a former student of Potchefstroom University I want to tell the hon Minister that the rector is hiding behind the hon Minister by telling people that it is the Minister who made the decision and they had no choice. That is what is being said out there and the hon Minister must take cognisance of this. Thank you. [Interjections.]]
Mr I S MFUNDISI: Deputy Speaker and hon members, it is a long and weary road that the restructuring of higher education has travelled. We have had instances in which some vice chancellors have threatened litigation while others were happy just to go along with the mergers. It is normal in society to have acquiescers, laggards and those resistant to change.
The pilot project of studying with some universities this year is most welcome. We look forward to the new-look North West University, the Tshwane University of Technology and the University of KwaZulu-Natal. The Minister deserves praise for the humane manner in which he resolved the problems of the Vice Chancellor of the University of Durban-Westville. He showed real leadership and did not go for the fall of the man whose tenure was ending anyway.
The recent disruption of classes at the present University of the North West calls for a thorough investigation. There is surely some unruly element that is bent on upsetting the applecart? Much can be said for and against the omission of the Vista Sebokeng component from the original plan to have it attached to the University of the North West.
We call on the authorities at the institutions to be considerate and not set their fees so high that economically disadvantaged students cannot afford them. The universities should be centres of excellence in teaching and research so that the graduates who emerge from them should be men and women of substance.
The UCDP supports the statement on the transformation and restructuring of higher education.
Dr M S MOGOBA: Madam Deputy Speaker, the PAC would like to congratulate the Minister on the way he handled a very difficult transformation exercise. We believe that he should be congratulated because higher education reflected the very artificial creation of institutions in our land, and this was not really good for our country.
Having said that, I spent the past weekend in Umtata. People there are a little bit anxious about the transformation. They accept it, but are wondering whether they are going to be served, whether this is going to produce results in the Transkei, or whether the people there will really develop. I believe that we need to be sensitive as far as that is concerned and ensure that this does happen.
We hope that the whole educational landscape will stabilise. The time has now come to reap the fruits, to begin to see the fruits, of education. We are hoping that very soon Afrocentric values will emerge, Afrocentric research will be done and that, on the whole, we will begin to enjoy the fruits coming out of universities of which we can rightly be proud.
Miss S RAJBALLY: Madam Deputy Speaker, the MF would like to take this opportunity to compliment the department and our hon Minister on the hard work to educate our nation and improve education throughout South Africa.
The challenges in education are many as we have a largely illiterate population, but this department, through education and skills training, has managed to make a great turnaround. The changes and development in higher education are supported and viewed as changes that will benefit our system.
It is encouraging to note the enthusiasm and co-operation of role-players in transforming higher education. We are especially pleased with the merger between the University of Natal and the University of Durban-Westville. We thank you, hon Minister, and those working under you for the fine development and management of our education nationally.
The MF supports the transformation process.
Mr C AUCAMP: Madam Deputy Speaker, the Minister said that the whole exercise requires us to balance different interests and needs. This did not happen. Universities with different cultures, ethos, languages, and characters were forced to merge, without balancing the different interests. Universities with proud histories were moved like pawns by the chess master on my right.
My own alma mater lost its name and its distinctive “For Christian Higher Education”. The Minister makes much of diversity and he states that, “we will not be bullied into uniform and one-dimensional perspectives of what universities mean”, but at the end of the day diversity, and this is something new in the eyes of the ANC, means that every school, every university and every organisation should reflect the demographics of the country. This is not diversity, because then everyone looks the same. This is uniformity.
The NA does not share the Minister’s excitement with his latest Big Brother move. I thank you.
Prof S M MAYATULA: Deputy Speaker and hon members, allow me, on behalf of the ANC Government, to thank the members who have come here to appreciate the difficult task that the education department has gone through in order to reconstruct the university scene.
I would first like to respond briefly to the comments made by the hon Steele. Firstly, I think he is concerned about the quality that will go hand in hand with mergers. I think if he had gone through the documentation that has to do with this and how this quality has been put upfront where, through the CHE, this will be monitored on a day-to-day basis, he would not have said what he has just said.
As far as credibility is concerned, I am not sure what credibility means when we are trying to transform and bring South Africans together to share in this new country we are building. Hon Steele also referred to massification. If he were to refer to current numbers and what is happening in our universities, compared to the depth that we have, I am sure again he would not be saying what he has been saying.
The right of dissent, I think, is contained in our Constitution - no Minister, President or whoever will ever be able to refuse anybody that. Again I think we need to sympathise with what happened, as shared by the hon Dudley, about the postponement of lectures. I think that that must be taken in the spirit of change. When you are involved in big changes like the ones that we have, surely things of that nature can be expected.
I want to believe that the transformation and restructuring of higher education is one of the greatest achievements of the ANC-led Government. It has literally turned the apartheid legacy upside-down. Who would ever have thought that Potchefstroom University would even have thought of sharing its resources with North West University, let alone come together with one management to be able to drive all the programmes? Who on earth would ever have thought of the University of Natal accrediting courses from the University of Durban-Westville so that students are able to move without any problems? What other magical formula could have been used to see the students of Pentech and the students of Cape Technikon working together, using all those resources in order to be groomed to be the students that we want?
For the first time, courses between universities are going to be portable. Many of us have come across students who lack only one course. Because they did this one course at this particular university and they happen to be attending another university now, they cannot do the same course. They have to go back to the first university for the whole year. I can give a practical example: I have two students doing Economics III at the University of Fort Hare. The external examiner is from the University of Port Elizabeth. He examines, moderates, does all sorts of things, but if that student dares to fail, there is no way he would be in a position to do that course in Port Elizabeth, if he happens to work there. But, through this portability, all that will change.
Again a number of students have been frustrated because they have been unable to change and share courses. If one glances at the mandate and the MTBP, one can also see that the ANC Government is ready to put its money where its mouth is. As the Minister has rightly said, sums of money - billions and billions of rands - have been set aside in order to finance this programme.
The new funding formula framework will encourage improvement and it will also encourage graduation-linked funding. That means for now we are going to pay for more of our people going through, as a sum of about R80 million has been allocated to assist those students who are unable to adapt in the higher institutions and this is going to assist our people and change the quality.
Hon Mfundisi is concerned about fees. I think I must be upfront again about one of the best options out there which says: If the University of the North-West is merged with Potchefstroom and the fees at Potchefstroom are R20 and the fees at North West were R10, suddenly those students are going to have to find an extra R10 somewhere. The Government is serious about these matters. It is going to assist those students so that this merger does not affect them negatively. Some of the programmes of this merger are going to change, in a sense.
I would like to borrow just one paragraph from the CHE. When they put their presentation before our committee on 11 November, this is what they said: In the South African context where the real past is in danger in the face of either amnesia or the tendency to invest in institutional histories in the service of immediate ends of institutional survival, it is important to restate the real past.
They went on to say that the inherited education system was designed in the main to reproduce, in teaching and research, white and male privilege, and black and female subordination in all spheres of society. And, they said that the one vitally important imperative and challenge was to transform our education so that it became more socially equitable internally and promoted social, equitable and more general aspects by providing opportunities for social advancement through equity of access and opportunity.
Previous research and teaching were extensively shaped by the social, economic and political priorities of apartheid-supported development programmes. Instead, higher education is now called on to address and become responsive to the development needs of a domestic South Africa. I thank you.
Debate concluded.
FILLING OF VACANCY ON MAGISTRATES COMMISSION
The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Hon members, I have received one nomination, namely the hon S N Swart of the ACDP. A second nomination was later withdrawn.
There were no further nominations.
Question put: That Mr S N Swart be elected as a member of the Magistrates Commission.
Question agreed to.
Mr S N Swart accordingly elected as a member of the Magistrates Commission.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON TRADE
AND INDUSTRY ON CHAIRPERSON OF NATIONAL LOTTERIES BOARD
Question put: That the recommendation that Mr J A Foster be appointed as chairperson of the Lotteries Board be approved.
Question agreed to.
Mr J A Foster accordingly recommended for appointment as chairperson of the National Lotteries Board.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON JUSTICE AND
CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT ON PREVENTION AND COMBATING OF CORRUPT
ACTIVITIES BILL
Report adopted without debate.
PREVENTION AND COMBATING OF CORRUPT ACTIVITIES BILL
(Second Reading debate)
The MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Deputy Speaker, thanks very much. The Bill before this House today, namely the Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Bill, reflects international best practice and legislation dealing with the prevention and combating of corruption and related corrupt activities.
The Bill provides for, amongst other things, the following: The strengthening of measures to prevent and combat corruption and corrupt activities; the creation of the general offence of corruption and offences relating to corrupt activities; investigative measures in respect of corruption and related corrupt activities; the establishment and endorsement of a register in order to place certain restrictions on persons and enterprises convicted of corrupt activities relating to tenders and contracts; it places a duty on certain persons holding a position of authority to report certain corrupt transactions; and it provides for extraterritorial jurisdiction in respect of the offence of corruption and offences relating to corrupt activities.
For this Government, the Bill represents a radical departure from the existing provisions relating to corruption contained in the current Corruption Act of 1992. Noteworthy in this regard are the following provisions: Firstly, clause 10, which aims at replacing the common law crime of bribery, prohibits the receiving and offering of unauthorised gratification by or to a person who is party to an employment relationship. Whereas the common law crime of bribery only applies to persons in the public sector, the offence in clause 10 aims at also applying to persons who are party to an employment relationship in the private sector.
Secondly, in terms of clause 17(1), any public officer who acquires or holds a private interest in any contract, agreement or investment emanating from or connected with the public body in which he or she is employed, or which is made on account of that public body, is guilty of an offence. This offence does not apply, amongst others, to a public officer who acquires or holds such interest as a shareholder of a listed company, or whose conditions of employment do not prohibit him or her from acquiring or holding such an interest.
Thirdly, clause 23 provides for the application by the National Director of Public Prosecutions and the issuing of an investigation direction by a judge in respect of the possession of property disproportionate to a person’s present or past loan resources, or sources of income or assets.
Following the issuing of an investigation direction, the national director has the following powers: He or she may summon the suspect or any other person specified in the investigation direction who is believed to be able to furnish any information relating to the property in his or her possession or under his or her control to appear before him or her, or a person authorised thereto, at a time and place specified in the summons, and to be questioned or to produce that property. He or she may question that suspect or other person under oath or affirmation, and examine or retain, for further examination or safe custody, such property.
He or she may enter any premises where the suspect is, or is suspected to be, and there inspect and search the premises, examine and seize any property found on the premises which has a bearing on the investigation in question. Any person who refuses or fails to give any information or explanation when required to do so in terms of the above provisions is guilty of an offence and liable to a fine or to imprisonment for a period not exceeding 10 years.
Fourthly, chapter 6 of the Bill provides for the establishment of a register for tender defaulters. This register is established in the office of the National Treasury. In terms of clause 28 a court may, in respect of an accused who has been found guilty in respect of corrupt activities relating to tenders and contracts, in addition to imposing any other sentence, issue an order in terms of which the particulars of the convicted person or enterprise must be endorsed on the register. This may include the endorsement of enterprises, partners, managers and directors involved in the commission of the offence.
Furthermore, the National Treasury may, or must as the case may be, where the register has been so endorsed, impose certain restrictions in respect of the persons or enterprises so endorsed. This includes: the termination of an agreement; the determination of a period of between 5 and 10 years for which the endorsement must remain on the register; and the disqualification relating to future tenders and contracts.
Clause 34 creates a duty to report certain corrupt transactions. However, it is important to note that this duty only applies to a person holding a position of authority as defined in the Bill. The duty only applies where such a person knows, or ought reasonably to have known, or suspected, that certain serious offences have been committed, and where the offence involves an amount of R100 000 or more.
Importantly, I am proud to say that South Africa has, within two years of the adoption of the Southern African Development Community Protocol Against Corruption on 14 August 2001, succeeded in drafting, accepting and approving legislation in compliance with the objectives of the protocol. In some instances, as mentioned, the Bill goes well beyond what is required by the protocol. Needless to say the enactment of this Bill will ensure our country’s compliance with the United Nations’ Convention Against Corruption that was adopted by the UN General Assembly on 31 October this year.
Last but not least, the Bill, once enacted, will constitute a critical component of a panel of legal instruments the Government uses in its fight against crime, in particular organised crime and corruption. Some of these legal instruments are the following: The numerous amendments to the Criminal Procedure Act that were adopted in 1995 and 1997 which strengthen our bail laws; the provision for the imposition of minimum sentences in respect of certain serious offences including corruption that was actually effected in 1997; the approval by Parliament in 1998 of the Prevention of Organised Crime Act to prevent and combat crime, money-laundering and criminal gain activities; the enactment in 1996 of the Special Investigating Units and Special Tribunals Act in order to create mechanisms through which allegations of serious corruption, maladministration or misappropriation of state funds can be investigated; and the enactment in 1998 of the National Prosecuting Authority Act which provides for the establishment of a single, national prosecuting authority.
In the year 2000 this Act was amended to provide for the establishment of a Directorate of Special Operations, popularly known as the Scorpions, with the aim to investigate crime committed in an organised fashion. In 2000 the Protected Disclosures Act was enacted in order to provide protection for persons who disclose information relating to criminal or irregular conduct in their places of work.
In 2002 the Regulation of Interception of Communications and Provision of Communication-related Information Act was enacted in order to bring the legislation dealing with the interception and monitoring of communications into line with the latest communication technologies. I must also mention that my colleague, the Minister for the Public Service and Administration, has introduced various comprehensive administrative measures in order to prevent and combat corruption in the public sector.
We can thus proclaim, without any fear of contradiction, that with the enactment of this Bill we will have in place a comprehensive and well co- ordinated anticorruption plan. However, it is axiomatic that a proper anticorruption strategy, a correct anticorruption plan, intelligence and appropriate legislation, and rigorous law enforcement are in and of themselves not adequate. As corruption is frequently a product of the culture of a society, a change in the culture is necessary and can indeed be achieved through, among other things, proactive work, education and training. We can win the war against corruption only if we have the co- operation of all. Finally, I wish to thank the Chairperson and members of the Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development for their hard work. They have, after many days of deliberation, produced an excellent product which I am sure will strengthen the hands of the criminal justice system in preventing and combating corruption and related activities. I thank you.
Adv J H DE LANGE: Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, hon members, ladies and gentlemen and the hon Mr Ellis, I rise on behalf of the ANC in unconditional support of the adoption of the Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Bill and commend its adoption to this House.
I start with a few thank you’s; firstly, to all the parties. It has been a long road. I think we have done sterling work at the end of the road and we can be proud of the work that we have done. To those parties that have been involved, that have been able to unanimously agree to this Bill, I say a big thank you. Secondly, I say a big thank you to Mr Gerard Nel, who has spent many days of his life down in Cape Town, when he could surely have been up in Pretoria spending his time there more fruitfully.
Our President, Comrade Thabo Mbeki, has consistently been in the forefront of our Government and the ANC’s war against corruption. The President has vociferously, consistently and unequivocally denounced any form of corruption. He has also propagated a zero-tolerance approach to such deviant and destructive behaviour, urging and supporting the vigorous ferreting out, prosecution and incarceration of such deviants.
The President’s response in the House yesterday on issues of corruption has again confirmed this uncompromising approach. A cursory glance over some of our President’s pronouncements over the last few years on this issue further contextualises this approach. I remind the nation of some of these details. On 10 October 1999, the President opined:
We must therefore conclude that corruption is a social phenomenon. In our own national case we would make bold to say that a basic factor which informs corruptive practice is the disjuncture that has occurred between spiritual and material human needs. It seems clearer that in that contest, the material has assumed precedence over the spiritual. In many instances, material values have gained their greater worth in the eyes of many people at the expense of spiritual values.
In this situation, success in the accumulation of material values becomes acceptable within our social value system as a pre-eminent goal to pursue and a pre-eminent criterion by which to judge as to whether the citizen is a successful person or a failure. Necessarily, this level of deification of material values downgrades the importance of the question of how these material values are acquired. The important thing is to have and to be known to have and not to question, how did you come to possess what you possess.
In a similar vein, on an earlier occasion on 10 November 1998, he said:
Since any Government is born of the society it seeks to govern, it will, to a good extent, be a mirror image of and a reflection of the prevalent levels of morality. In the macrocontext of world values, where the private accumulation of material wealth is unleashed, a total onslaught on every other determining value possible, mental conditioning remains captive to the triumph of the stronger flow of success measured as personal prosperity.
That we as South Africans in all spheres of life have been overtaken by material self-seeking should therefore come as no surprise, even if it’s contrary to public interest and at the public expense. In this regard, it is incumbent on Government unequivocally to affirm its seriousness and desire to stamp out corruption wherever it occurs. Perpetrators of corrupt practice in both the public and private sectors will be severely punished for contributing to this moral mayhem which has been allowed to creep into the fabric of our society.
Zero tolerance will be shown to the parasites of our land who have scorned the public interest and sought their own self-enrichment at the state’s expense. For it is against them and against the antinomian culture they seek to perpetuate that we must continually rebel. Such rebellion must of necessity take on a public face, for collusion of individuals in deviant behaviour contrary to the common good is usually cloaked in silence. Government is firmly committed to come down harshly against all forms of corruption, including bribery and abuse of public trust.
I have quoted the President in some detail to highlight the unequivocal and uncompromising leadership he has consistently provided in this regard, despite a few incorrect averments by some to the contrary. It has become an internationally accepted truism that corruption undermines ethical values and morality, democratic institutions and values, as well as the rule of law, and disturbs the development priorities of a country. It slows down sustainable economic growth and jeopardises sustainable development by disrupting the distribution of scarce resources.
Corruption exists everywhere, but it does most harm in those areas where resources are already limited. It obviously also undermines the credibility of governments and provides a fertile breeding ground for organised crime, ultimately endangering the stability and the security of societies. Corrupt actions in all spheres of life, especially by public officials, are not countenanced by any country, at least not publicly, if that government wishes to retain its authority to enforce the law.
What exactly is corruption? The US scholar Hanning cogently deals with this issue fully in his scholarly work, from which I borrowed liberally. He points out that there is no single definition of corruption and the term has described everything from blatant acts of bribery, to the use of political power to advance personal and party agendas. While every nation has criminalised the bribing of government officials, bribery is only one manifestation of corruption. Criminal law is not the only means to inhibit corruption. Many nations have also adopted ethical guidelines for public administration and regulations on campaign finances to limit the opportunity to misuse and improperly influence public authority. A few nations have even tried to introduce such ethical guidelines into the private sphere of life.
The issue of corruption has become one of the leading matters exercising the collective mind of the international community. Many nations have worked at the international level to enhance the fight against all forms of corruption wherever it’s found - especially public corruption - through the adoption of multilateral agreements, requiring the signatory countries to adopt tougher domestic criminal laws on all forms of corruption to punish both abusers of public authority and abusers within the private sphere. A case in point is the pending signing by the international community at the end of this year of the United Nations Convention Against Corruption.
Corruption is not a term acceptable to easy definition. In the criminal law, the fundamental form of corruption is bribery. Judge Noonan captures it as follows, and I quote:
The core of the concept of a bribe is an inducement improperly influencing the performance of a public function meant to be gratuitously exercised.
Every definition of corruption incorporates bribery as the principle form of misconduct and then usually seeks to expand the concept to cover a broader array of conduct. Another scholar cogently described the problem with drafting laws, which we also found in this case, to criminalise corruption beyond bribery as follows, and I quote:
The crime of bribery is the black core of a series of concentric circles representing the degrees of impropriety into official behaviour. In this conception, a series of grey circles around the bribery core growing progressively lighter as they become more distant from the centre, until they blend into the surrounding white which represents perfectly proper and innocent conduct.
Adding to the difficulty in defining corruption is the absence of reliable measures of its pervasiveness beyond general perceptions that a government or a Ministry is corrupt. Relying solely on conduct that constitutes a criminal violation will not demonstrate whether corruption is rampant because the misconduct is so difficult to detect that conviction rates provide little insight into the scope of the problem. Moreover, corruption in many instances occurs without a victim. At least in the common sense of that term it is a person, not a party to the violation, who suffers the effect of a crime and who may report it to the authorities.
The hallmarks of corruption are stealth and obfuscation between extensively co-operating parties, and the pursuit of criminal cases can be hampered by the involvement of offenders who possess a good reputation and high social standing. Corruption is certainly among the most difficult crimes to investigate and prosecute successfully. To elaborate further on this point: although corruption is not a victimless crime per se, unlike most crimes, the victim is often not easily identifiable. Usually, those involved are beneficiaries in some way and have an interest in preserving secrecy.
Clear evidence of the actual payment of a bribe can be exceptionally hard to obtain and corrupt practices frequently remain unpunished. The traditional methods of evidence gathering will often not lead to satisfactory results. Additional laws are needed, providing for more innovative evidence-gathering procedures such as integrity testing, amnesty regulations for those involved in the corrupt transaction, whistle-blower protection, the abolition and/or limiting of enhanced bank, corporate and professional secrecy, money-laundering and access to information statutes.
Therefore, it can be concluded that corruption is an expanding and quite flexible concept. Efforts to adopt new criminal laws to address the broader concerns about official misconduct, therefore, should move beyond the bribery paradigm as a predominant form of corruption. A law, unlike a scholarly definition, must state the elements of the offence with sufficient precision to inform those subject to its strictures what criminal conduct is and what penalties they may incur for a violation.
The broader the scope of the law, the greater the possibility that arguably acceptable conduct will come within the criminal provision and result in punishment for acts that are not morally blameworthy. How has this approach been adopted and incorporated in the drafting of our corruption Bill? My colleagues and my comrades will, in the next few hours, give you a more detailed overview on that. [Interjections.] Listen to what is said about corruption. Don’t worry or be so evasive about this one. [Interjections.] Listen well, if you want to hear, Sheila. It is not enough. You must hear the other side - the right side.
Let me tell you what our approach has been. It’s been international best practice to take the crime of corruption and unbundle it, firstly, by creating a general all-encompassing crime of corruption; and then, over and above that overall general crime of corruption, creating specific crimes of corruption within different spheres of life. Therefore, we have created further offences specifically for public officials and foreign public officials; for agents of the principal in certain instances; for members of the legislative authority - there are specific criminal offence for MPs, so you better be careful of what you do from now on; for the judiciary; and for the prosecuting authority. Then we have created further offences in the area of trials in general, namely the corruption of evidence in trials; contracts; tendering processes; auctions; and then the famous Gibbs and Hansie Cronjé situation around sporting events, as well as around gaming and gambling.
Then we also looked further at the crime of bribery. As you know, in 1992, this crime was repealed. There was a suggestion that it should again be incorporated in this legislation and be unrepealed, so to speak. We have decided to do so, but not to do it as narrowly as in the past. Therefore, we have expanded the previous crime of bribery which only applied to public officials. We have also expanded it to the private sector. Therefore, anyone in an employment relationship - whether you are an employer or employee - if you take any undue gratification for the work that you should be doing, henceforth, that will be a crime in terms of clause 10 of this Bill.
Furthermore, there was a suggestion in connection with a situation where persons have excessive wealth. We have looked at this matter quite carefully. It is true that around the world, crimes like that are being created in some countries. Unfortunately the proponents of these crimes are usually in countries like Singapore, which do not necessarily have the greatest human rights records. As far as we are concerned, there are certain problems constitutionally and around the questions of desirability to create such a crime.
What we did instead was that we did not go ahead and endorse the crime that was created in the legislation, but we rather created a particular investigative mechanism whereby the prosecuting authority can approach the courts and seek an investigation direction in a case where they feel that someone has excessive wealth. Therefore, the rule of law will run its course more carefully, in doing so.
I also want to mention another innovation in this Bill. The Bill was introduced by creating a duty for public servants to report every instance of corruption. We felt once again that it was an unbalanced way of looking at things and that it was wrong not to treat things equally within the private and public sectors. We have now created a duty at a specific level within our society to report corruption. What we have done is that regarding persons in positions of authority - certain civil servants above a certain rank or, in the private sector, certain persons that hold senior management positions - henceforth, there would be a duty upon them to report any form of corruption amounting to more than R100 000 to the police. We have done so by trying to create capacity around this issue. Hopefully, in years to come, we will be able to create a more generalised duty for citizens to report all corruption in this country.
We obviously hope that this will put an end to those golden handshakes that are given to people, particularly in the top echelons of the private sector. As soon as corruption is found amongst them, the way that they get rid of the person is not to prosecute and not to make such matters known, but to actually give a golden handshake. My colleagues and comrades will deal with some of the other relevant issues in the Bill. Can I just thank everyone for listening and, once again, for unanimously supporting this Bill. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Mrs S M CAMERER: The DA has no hesitation in supporting this Bill. In fact we have been agitating to beef up our anticorruption legislation since February 2001, when we introduced in Parliament three Private Members’ Bills to amend the 1992 Corruption Act. We are happy to say that most of our suggestions have been incorporated in this Bill.
As far as I am aware, all parties who participated in the committee’s work unanimously support the Bill. Only the hon De Lille, who was never seen in the committee and is not participating in the debate today and is not even in this House - she very seldom is - has told the media that she is against the Bill, unaccountably.
Corruption in the public sector and, to some extent, in the private sector, is rife in our country and is in danger of really becoming systemic. Corruption seems to permeate all the way to the top, unfortunately. The allegation of corruption against the Deputy President now before our courts is a huge embarrassment to our country. We accept that the Deputy President must be regarded as innocent until proven guilty, but a public document before our courts establishing a prima facie case of corruption against him is a dreadful situation.
The ruling party clearly has a huge credibility problem around the issue of corruption. The Shaikh tentacles have also reached another high-profile ANC figure in the person of the former Transport Minister, Mr Mac Maharaj, who is also under investigation by the Scorpions for transactions linked to Shaikh. Then there are the fraud and corruption cases against Winnie Mandela and Tony Yengeni.
Moving away from personalities, just a few striking examples of currently alleged corruption in Government institutions indicate the size of the problem. Recently, the Justice department called for a special investigation authorised by the President into the disappearance of more than R100 million in fines, maintenance and bail money held by the department. The Road Accident Fund may have wasted R61 million last year with the fund’s audit committee detailing 35 serious irregularities and contraventions of the Public Finance Management Act. There is the ongoing R7 million Land Bank fraud trial. New Home Affairs Director-General, Barry Gilder, has just gone on record that corruption in his department is widespread and even endemic. Transnet is investigating corruption involved in a R53 million Spoornet contract. Then there are the goings-on at the University of Durban-Westville, the fraud in the Golden Arrow bus company, and the driver’s licence frauds unearthed in Limpopo and Mpumalanga. There are reports of extensive corruption coming from all provinces, which will take far too long to detail.
I do not believe any member of this House needs convincing that South Africa needs a comprehensive anticorruption law, which follows the modern trend of international legislation by unbundling corruption in terms of which various specific corrupt practices and actions are defined, prohibited and attract heavy sentences as well as the general definition of corruption in the Bill. As our chair in the portfolio committee has pointed out, a number of specifically defined corrupt activities are detailed, such as those relating to public officers, members of the legislative authorities, and those associated with legal proceedings such as the judicial authority, the prosecuting authority, witnesses and then foreign public officials. The role of agents is dealt with in detail, as are tenders, auctions, contracts, sporting events, gambling, etc. If this sounds like belt and braces, this was the intention - to have an all- embracing comprehensive statute that will be effective in combating corruption in all quarters of human endeavour, whether public or private.
It also attempts to bring within its ambit all those from the public or private sectors who attempt corrupt activities, even if they do not achieve them. Spelling out these offences in detail should assist the prosecution. For instance, many of the allegations in the Shaikh and Marais/Malatsi trials, currently underway, have a direct correlation with specifically spelt-out offences in the Bill.
Three further innovative aspects are to be welcomed in the establishment of the tender defaulter’s register, the incorporation of a duty on persons holding a position of authority to report corrupt transactions, whether known or suspected, and modelled on similar provisions contained in the Prevention of Organised Crime and Financial Intelligence Centres Act, and the requirement to explain sudden discrepancies between known income and lifestyle.
Getting to this point was a stop-start affair. The Bill was before the committee for over a year and a half. For a while, the DA had questions about the political will of the governing party to fight corruption and to get the legislation passed. And, in this regard, it is worth quoting the hon Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development at the Government’s international anticorruption conference, held in Durban four years ago, when he said:
The problem may not be the absence of clear national strategies. It may not even be the paucity of resources to implement such plans. The disturbing feature of most anticorruption campaigns has been the lack of political will.
It took another two years for the Cabinet to adopt the National Anticorruption Strategy for the public sector and four years to bring this comprehensive anticorruption legislation to Parliament.
Once it is passed, we hope the Government will put adequate resources and mechanisms behind the legislation to ensure effective implementation. It has to be admitted that corruption is a notoriously difficult crime to define, pursue and obtain convictions on. Few, if any, were achieved under the 1992 legislation.
Dr De Kock of the SA Police Service’s crime analysis centre, responding to my request for statistics two days ago, indicated that figures pertaining to corruption are not readily available as a large number of corruption cases are registered under codes like theft and fraud. Very often, as in the Yengeni case, the corruption charge is dropped in favour of getting a theft and fraud conviction. The Justice committee has laboured long and hard to ensure that, in future, corruption charges will stick. All the major international statutes and the United Nations convention have been consulted and, where possible, incorporated and, in this regard, I would like to commend Advocate Gerard Nel for his dogged hard work.
Corruption manifests itself in various forms, the chief of which are bribery, embezzlement, fraud, extortion, abuse of power, conflict of interest, insider trading, favouritism and nepotism. This latter aspect is one of the most difficult manifestations of corruption to pin down. After all, how far do you go in family relationships? This is perhaps one of the few areas that is not adequately covered by this Bill.
The DA sincerely hopes that, armed with this legislation, the Government will begin to win the fight against corruption. It will surely have no more excuses. It will also have an international obligation to stand up and be counted in the global battle against corruption once the Government signs the United Nations Convention Against Corruption in December. Thank you very much, Chair.
Mr M V NGEMA: Thank you, Deputy Chairperson. Normally Mr Vezi and Mr Van der Merwe would have spoken on this subject of the portfolio committee, but due to problems, they have not been able to be here.
First of all, I wish to state that the IFP supports the Bill before the House. I am not going to repeat what previous speakers have said as we all agree on the Bill. It is common cause that South Africa is struggling to prevent and combat corrupt activities and that we need legislation to effectively deal with it. Yes, there are many rumours of corruption. Many people are charged, convicted and sentenced, but still corruption is rife.
We in the IFP are of the opinion that legislation is but part of the solution. In addition to legislation, prosecution and imprisonment of offenders, South Africa needs more. What we also need is moral regeneration. Our country should seriously pull up its moral socks. Family values should be treasured. Discipline at home, in the schools, at the workplace, all over, should be brought back and enforced. Our country needs men and women to take the lead in our country’s moral rehabilitation. We, as members of Parliament, should especially take lead.
In conclusion, no law alone will be effective enough to deal with corruption unless we have the moral capacity to sustain it. Only then will we overcome corruption in South Africa. I thank you.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order! Hon members, the hon V Meruti, who is going to be speaking next, will be making her maiden speech. [Applause.]
Ms V MERUTI: Deputy Chairperson, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, the report of the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime and the Country Corruption Assessment Report on behalf of the South African Government have been received by the Speaker of the National Assembly, Dr Frene Ginwala, and then launched by her, the Minister for the Public Service and Administration - Comrade Geraldine Fraser-Moleketi - and a representative of the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, and their regional officer for Southern Africa - Mr Rob Boone.
There is express political will in South Africa to address this problem. In recent years the Government has taken several significant steps, not only to ensure a clean public administration system, but also to signal its intention to be responsive to local and international pressure and encouragement towards good governance and to promote greater openness, transparency and accountability.
About 80% of corruption cases in Government reported in the media are discovered by the ANC-led Government. [Applause.] South Africa contributes actively and substantially to international and regional anticorruption efforts. The country is improving in terms of legislation. Several pieces of legislation’s enforcement structures are unique in the region, and of the highest international standards. South Africa is improving in terms of increased institutional capacity to investigate and prosecute corrupt practices.
By international standards, South Africa belongs to the group of countries that occupy a middle position regarding their vulnerability to corruption. This is clearly the position of South Africa with respect to the Transparency International corruption perception.
Among developing countries, South Africa is perceived as one of the least corrupt, and as the developing country whose citizens are least exposed to public sector corruption. The Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Bill seeks to provide for the strengthening of measures to prevent and combat corruption and corrupt activities, to provide for investigative measures in respect of corruption, to provide for the establishment and endorsement of a register in order to place certain restrictions on persons and enterprises convicted of corrupt activities relating to tenders and contracts, and to place a duty on certain persons holding a position of authority to report certain corrupt transactions.
Since 1994, the ANC-led Government has put numerous anticorruption programmes and projects in place. I would like to end with a quote from President Mbeki’s speech at the National Anticorruption Summit in April 1999:
If the religious leaders present amongst us will pardon me, I would like to cite a number of verses from the King James version of the Biblical book of Ecclesiastes in an effort to answer the question: What went wrong? “I sought in my mind how to give myself unto wine, yet acquainted my heart with wisdom; … I gathered me also silver and gold and the peculiar treasure of kings and of the provinces: I gat me men singers and women singers, and the delights of the sons of men, as musical instruments, and that of all sorts”.
Obviously this text gives a vivid description of a very successful resident of Jerusalem who, through his labour, has all the material things that every one of us would like to have, from wine to silver and gold; from an army of servants to inhouse musicians; and from an abundance of food to what is described as “the delights of the sons of men”, yet the text goes on:
Then I looked on all the works that my hands had wrought, and on the labour that I had laboured to do: and, behold, all was vanity and vexation of spirit, and there was no profit under the sun.
It seems to me that this text correctly raises what is perhaps at the heart of the problem of corruption which we have to confront - the relationship within each human being and each society between the material and the spiritual.
All philosophies recognise the fact that what distinguishes us as human beings from other forms of animal existence, is that we have both material and spiritual needs. Thus, the normal human being we would like to see, and to be, is a person who succeeds in maintaining the necessary balance between these needs, between what is materially necessary, and what is morally correct.
In many instances our society itself describes as successful, and as people to be emulated, those who are like the residents of Jerusalem described in Ecclesiastes, those who have accumulated more wealth than any other who ever lived in that city. No questions are asked about the ethical behaviour of any of us as part of determining whether we should be emulated or not. Success is defined as success in having addressed effectively the material needs of the human being. Therefore, our youth grow up knowing that to be deemed a success, one must possess the luxury cars whose brand names are familiar to all of us, one must have a big expensive house and dress in the finest garments available on the market.
The issue of how these possessions are acquired is immaterial. Indeed, to have acquired them without having worked for them is itself applauded as demonstrating ingenuity and a fleetness of foot and mind. In such a situation, to commit murder to advance my goal of accumulating wealth becomes permissible. To rob an old age pensioner of his or her pension, becomes but a mere means of reaching the goal of self-enrichment by the shortest route possible. To steal public resources is merely to do the done thing by taking advantage of the position you find yourself in. Access to these resources is by virtue of the fact that you happen to be employed in the Public Service. To rape women and children is also to take advantage of an opportunity to gratify what is described in Ecclesiastes as “the delights of the sons of men”.
What I am trying to say is that our society evolved in a manner which gave rise to a situation in which a disastrous collapse of social values occurred, to be replaced by the notion that what is good is what serves my individual material interest and pleasures. I believe that if we were able to correctly answer the question regarding what went wrong, we would be halfway to finding the solution which would make it possible for all of us to realise the common dream of creating a decent and caring human society of which all our people would be proud.
Yes, the ANC-led Government has programmes in place to better our country, and we can win with the co-operation of all, including the DA. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr D M BAKKER: Deputy Chair, may I first of all commend the previous speaker on an excellently prepared maiden speech. It is quite clear that she will make a very valuable contribution to this House.
When I saw the speakers’ list today I was very excited, because I thought I was going to see an old friend of mine again - the hon Koos van der Merwe - after not having seen him for quite some time. But the IFP speaker, who stood in for him - I also have to stand in for another member - did very well.
The Roman orator and scholar Cicero once remarked, and I quote:
Those who mean to take charge of the affairs of government should not fail to remember two of Plato’s rules. Firstly, keep the good of the people clearly in view so that, regardless of their own interest, they will make their every action conform to that. Secondly, care for the welfare of the whole body politic and do not serve the interests of some one party to betray the rest, for the administration of a government - like the office of a trustee - must be conducted for the benefit of those entrusted to one’s care, not for that of those to whom it is entrusted.
The Bill before us today aims to promote and strengthen measures to prevent and combat corruption more effectively. It will also increase accountability and proper management of public affairs and public property. Good governance and fighting corruption are among the most important challenges facing any government. The New NP last week proposed in the Gauteng legislature that a register of persons involved in corruption against the provincial government or municipalities in Gauteng should be compiled. Therefore, we want to propose that drawing up a name and shame list should be considered in the various provinces. This will ensure that the perpetrators cannot continue their criminal activities elsewhere. Such a list should be distributed among state departments, parastatals and municipalities for consideration before employing people or awarding Government tenders or contracts. This list can be based on the well-known credit record system which allows appropriate credit checks that protect the rights of individuals, but in particular also meet the requirements of good governance.
Korrupsie kan nie uitgeroei word as die skuldiges telkemale stil-stil verdwyn en hulle werk net op ‘n ander plek voortsit nie. Die swartlys moet nie slegs staatsamptenare wat oortree insluit nie, maar ook diegene wat amptenare korrupteer deur omkopery of ander vorme van onwettige beïnvloeding. Mense wat hulle skuldig maak aan omkopery, is skuldig aan ‘n baie ernstige misdaad. As daar nie omkopers is nie, kan amptenare nie omgekoop word nie. Benewens kriminele vervolging, moet maatreëls ingestel word om seker te maak dat sulke staatsdiewe, hulle frontmaatskappye of vennote tot in die spreekwoordelike derde en vierde geslag nie weer naby ‘n staatskontrak toegelaat kan word nie.
Die Ontvanger van Inkomste speel ook ‘n belangrike rol as bykomende sanksie in hierdie proses. Dit sal sorg dat die opbrengs van korrupsie teen die staat nie in die misdadigers of hulle vennote se sakke bly nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Corruption cannot be eradicated if the guilty parties quietly disappear time and time again, only to carry on their activities elsewhere. The blacklist should not only include public servants who have violated the law, but also those persons who corrupt officials by bribery or other forms of illegal influence.
People who commit bribery are guilty of a very serious crime. If there are no bribers, officials cannot be bribed. In addition to criminal prosecution, measures should be implemented to ensure that people such as these who steal from the state, their front companies or partners will not be allowed near a state contract up to the proverbial third or fourth generation.
The Receiver of Revenue also plays an important role as an additional sanction in this process. This will ensure that the gains from corruption against the state will not remain in the pockets of the criminals or their partners.]
Those who are aware of corrupt practices and refrain from reporting them should also be held accountable. South Africa has to keep track of international developments with regard to corruption and means to effectively combat it.
Legislation in South Africa, such as the Promotion of Administrative Justice Act, provides a very good basis for this anticorruption Bill. This Bill will further enhance a culture of clean government and transparency. It will enhance the effectiveness of investigating and prosecuting corruption cases and, therefore, the New NP supports this Bill. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr S N SWART: Deputy Chair, hon Minister, may I first thank the House for its unanimous support of my nomination for the Magistrates Commission. I shall do my best to represent the House and the best interests of this new democracy on this commission and consider it a great honour. I thank you. [Applause.]
The ACDP supports the tough new provisions intended to combat corruption contained in this Bill. In view of the widespread corruption, both in the private and public spheres, there can be no doubt that a comprehensive, integrated and multidisciplinary approach is required.
As far back as 1400 BC Moses indicated: “We must not accept bribes, for the bribe blinds the eye of the wise and subverts the cause of those of you who are right.” Bribery and corruption undermine human development and a transition to stable democratic rule. They prop up illegitimate regimes as corporations bid for contracts by bribing. Wealthy nations are wakening up to this and criminalising the practice of bribing foreign public officials. Similar provisions are contained in this Bill. However, such measures must be combined with stringent domestic anticorruption strategies. If corruption is not addressed, the risk of investing private capital in economies, perceived to be highly corrupt, is further increased.
We support the provisions relating to blacklisting of persons or companies found guilty of tendering for contracts corruptly, as well as the provisions relating to the duty on persons in authority to report corrupt transactions. Whilst we are also in broad agreement with most of the provisions, we agree that more attention needs to be given to address the serious problem of nepotism whereby family and friends of high-ranking Government officials are awarded state contracts.
What South Africa, however, ultimately requires is a restoration of conscience, of morality. A corruption-free society can only be created by virtuous people whose individual consciences guard their behaviour and hold them accountable. Without conscience a society can be held in check only by coercion. Even coercion ultimately fails, for there is no police force large enough to keep an eye on every individual. [Time expired.] [Applause.]
Mnr P J GROENEWALD: Mnr die Voorsitter, die Wetsontwerp op die Voorkoming van Korrupsie word werklik verwelkom deur die VF Plus, en ons steun die wetsontwerp.
Maar ek wil vir die agb Minister sê daar is ‘n Engelse spreekwoord wat sê “the proof of the pudding is in the eating”. Ons kom hier na die Parlement en ons maak wetsontwerpe, maar as dit by die uitvoering daarvan kom, sit ons met ‘n bepaalde probleem. As ons sê ons wil ‘n wet op die voorkoming van korrupsie hê, en dat hy streng toegepas moet word, moet die boodskap wat ons na die publiek uitstuur ‘n boodskap wees wat sê ons is streng.
Ek moet vandag vir u sê die boodskap na buite is dat die Regering van die dag sag is op korrupsie. En hoekom sê ek dit? Die boodskap is daar word nie regtig streng opgetree nie, want as ons in die media kyk, lees ons van staatsamptenare wat korrupsie gepleeg het, maar wat net weer herontplooi word. Of ons lees van staatsamptenare wat korrupte aktiwiteite gepleeg het, en wat al twee jaar wag vir ‘n saak om afgehandel te word, wat hoë poste met hoë salarisse behou - belastingbetalers se geld - en dan is die boodskap wat uitgaan: ons is eintlik maar sag op korrupsie.
Ek wil vir die agb Minister sê die VF steun hierdie wetsontwerp, maar dan moet ons ook in die praktyk daadwerklik streng teen hierdie mense optree sodat die boodskap wat ons na buite uitstuur ‘n boodskap is om te sê ons is ernstig met dit wat ons doen hier in die hoogste Raadsaal van die land. Dankie, Voorsitter. (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.) [Mr P J GROENEWALD: Mr Chairperson, the Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Bill is really welcomed by the FF Plus, and we support this Bill.
But I want to tell the hon Minister that there is an English idiom that goes “the proof of the pudding is in the eating”. We come to Parliament and pass Bills, but when it comes to implementing them we have a specific problem. When we say we want an Act on the prevention of corruption, and that it should be enforced strictly, the message we send out to the public must be that we are strict.
I must tell you today that the message going out is that the Government of the day is soft on corruption. And why am I saying this? The message is that no really strict action is taken, because if we look at the media, we read about public servants who committed corruption, who are simply redeployed. Or we read about public servants who are engaged in corrupt activities, and have been waiting for two years for a case to be resolved, who retain high posts with high salaries - taxpayers’ money - and then the message that goes out is: We are actually soft on corruption.
I want to tell the hon Minister that the FF supports this Bill, but then we must also in practice take strong action against these people so that the message we send out is that we are serious about what we are doing here in the highest Chamber of the country. Thank you, Chairperson.]
Mr M T MASUTHA: Deputy Chairperson, hon members, comrades, I must also add my voice in expressing appreciation for the wonderful inputs that have been made this afternoon, especially the input on moral regeneration by Comrade Meruti in her maiden speech.
The Bill before us today, which is the product of painstaking work of the Justice committee and especially its chairperson, Comrade Johnny de Lange, with the support of a dedicated team of departmental drafters, is finally being considered by this Parliament before the end of its term. The introduction of this legislation by the ANC-led Government is a manifestation - and even the DA had to acknowledge this - of how serious the ANC is about sniffing out and uprooting all forms of corrupt behaviour, wherever and in whatever form it occurs within Government, the private sector and society in general.
At it’s 51st national conference held in Stellenbosch in December last year, the ANC noted, amongst the resolutions it took, and I quote:
Corruption is a social scourge that cuts across the public and private sectors and society at large and involves a transaction between at least the giver and the receiver.
Corruption and unethical conduct pose a major challenge within the public, private and civil sectors, and that wherever it occurs it undermines the values and objectives of the national democratic revolution.
It further noted, and I quote:
Government has enacted legislation, such as the Public Finance Management Act and Protected Disclosures Act, which protect whistle-blowers, to limit the areas in which corruption can take place, and is in the process of passing further legislation necessary to combat corruption.
The President, as many have already mentioned before me, has on more than one occasion in this House alluded to the important point that most of the corruption, about 80%, that comes into the public domain is uncovered as a result of Government initiatives to investigate and prosecute suspects both within and outside of Government itself. Further, in virtually all his state of the nation addresses, the President has, since he took office in 1999, announced various initiatives taken by Government to tackle corruption.
In his 2002 address, for example, the President had the following to say, and I quote:
In accordance with the Government’s comprehensive Public Service anticorruption strategy, we have introduced measures to ensure that the code of conduct is upheld, and that all Public Service managers are subject to conflict of interest disclosures. To complement this, legislation to fight corruption will be brought before Parliament during this session.
Indeed, we are today considering that legislation which, although it took so long to complete owing to the complexity and illusive nature of corruption, is one of the most precious gifts that could not have come at a better time than now, on the eve of the celebration of our first decade of democracy as a free nation.
The ANC’s 10-year review document, under the heading “Fighting Corruption”, outlines some of the numerous anticorruption programmes and projects that have been put in place by the new Government since 1994. These include the establishment in March 1997, by the government sectors responsible for the SA National Crime Prevention Strategy, NCPS, of a programme committee to work on corruption in the criminal justice system itself. A fundamental point of departure in contextualising this challenge is that corruption is a scourge that erodes the gains that we have made in our transition as a people from the repressive, immoral and corrupt rule of apartheid that indulged in, and was sustained through, the vices of bias, exclusion, clandestine dealings, deceit, brutality and all other forms of humiliation against our people, to an open and democratic society based on the values of freedom, equality and human dignity enshrined in our Constitution and the Bill of Rights.
In order to safeguard these gains, the Constitution has in Chapter 9 further created state institutions supporting constitutional democracy, which include the Public Protector, the Human Rights Commission, the Auditor-General, etc, as independent institutions accessible to the public and protected under the Constitution itself. Yesterday, in his reply to a question posed to him, for example, the President alluded to an investigation by these institutions into alleged irregularities in the arms deal that was requested by this House, the report of which is often downplayed by the official opposition, especially because it did not produce an outcome that suited its political goals.
The opposition must grow up and learn that democracy is not about finding people guilty of things they have not been proven to be guilty of just because the opposition says so. After all, we have, over and above the institutions I have just alluded to, independent courts which have the power to decide whether a person has committed an offence or not.
Turning to the substance of the Bill itself, let me start by stating that unlike its predecessor, the Corruption Act of 1992, this Bill adopts a targeted approach to corruption by above all creating a general offence of corruption, identifying the various areas in which corruption manifests itself, with all its ever-elusive characteristics, and, in a very detailed and careful way, dealing with it so as to maximise the net within which corrupt activities can be captured. There are special provisions to deal specifically with, for example, evidence in legal proceedings, in particular witnesses and evidential material; provisions relating to procuring and withdrawal of tenders, auctions, contracts, sporting events, gambling and games of chance.
The common law crime of bribery is at the heart of what is referred to as corruption. This crime, however, is generally understood only in the context of the abuse by public officials of their positions of advantage to benefit themselves by entering into shady deals, usually involving the private sector and members of the general public. Because these deals are often clinched under a veil of secrecy, it is often difficult to identify them or to prove their occurrence, hence the need for a sophisticated instrument, such as the Bill before us, to match up to the daunting task of sniffing out these corrupt activities.
The Bill also provides for the establishment of a register for tender defaulters. This register is established in the office of the National Treasury. In terms of clause 28, a court may, in respect of an accused who has been found guilty of corrupt activities relating to tenders and contracts, in addition to imposing any other sentence, issue an order in terms of which the particulars of the convicted person or enterprise must be endorsed in the register. This may include the endorsement of enterprises, partners, managers and directors involved in the commission of the offence.
Furthermore, the National Treasury may or must, as the case may be, where the register has been so endorsed, impose certain restrictions in respect of the person or enterprise so endorsed. This includes the termination of an agreement, the determination of a period between five and 10 years for which the endorsement must remain on the register, and the disqualification relating to future tenders and contracts.
The Bill further creates the duty to report certain corrupt transactions. It is important that this duty only applies to persons who hold a position of authority as defined in the Bill. Furthermore, the duty only applies where such a person knows or ought reasonably to have known or suspected that certain serious offences have been committed, and where the offence involves an amount of R100 000 or more.
Let me conclude by stating that corruption is a thief that steals from the poor by eroding the meagre public resources that Government has made available to them and giving to those who are greedy and wish to reap where they did not sow. The challenge, therefore, is for all of us to assist the various institutions, both in Government and in the private sector, that seek to uproot corruption by volunteering information about corrupt activities and the culprits behind them. We must use the tools that Government has provided us with to fight this scourge, and not merely fold our arms and wait for some angel to do it for us.
The ANC views this Bill as being a critical step in the pursuit of that noble goal of creating a better life for all. Therefore we support the Bill wholeheartedly. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr I S MFUNDISI: Chairperson, hon members, Edward Biggon wrote, and I quote, “The laws of a nation form the most instructive portion of its history.” This is relevant to the South African situation. Posterity will come to learn from laws such as this one that corruption was once rife in our country. A responsible nation will not sit down with a tear or a frown in the face of all that, hence the effort to paddle our own canoe by unbundling corruption, as we are doing.
The Bill creates offences in respect of specific persons, and in the interest of time, I shall confine myself to public officers. As defined in the Bill, it refers to public servants and to members of Parliament, of provincial legislatures and of municipal councils.
According to the Bill, in so far as it affects public officers, it is improper for them to vote at public meetings. This implies that people in the Public Service, as contemplated in section 8(1) of the Public Service Act, Act 103 of 1994, have to know where and what to do and how to do it. Failing to perform and not performing one’s official duties adequately is corruption in itself. Such clots in the system block the free circulation and may cause thrombosis, and have to be got rid of. After all, thrombosis is a condition of paralysis. Any paralysed part of the body cannot function properly, thus if a body is infected with thrombosis - public servants who do not perform properly - it cannot function well.
Partiality is also corrupt behaviour on the part of public officers. They are expected to act even-handedly and treat all people alike. Public officers should not be seen to be hobnobbing with this or that political party. Their duty is to serve the government of the day. The Bill warns against public officers … [Time expired.]
Miss S RAJBALLY: Chairperson, may I take this opportunity to compliment hon Meruti on her maiden speech. Well done. I also want to congratulate hon Swart on his position on the Magistrates Commission.
Sadly, corruption is evident in South Africa. We have taken note, with much dismay, of charges of corruption being levelled against some of our very prominent people. Our disgust at corrupt behaviour is infinite, considering the poverty of our nation.
The MF is strongly anticorruption, and therefore supports the prevention of corruption wholeheartedly. It is hoped that introducing laws that make a number of actions corrupt, will instil fear in criminals. It is also hoped that awareness of corruption will increase, and that greater emphasis on moral behaviour will lead to the prevention of corruption.
In our democracy we strive to assure our citizenry that we are the Government of the people, and that we are trying our utmost to govern in their best interest. Acts of corruption in our system break down this confidence, and no matter how hard the majority of us try to maintain and ensure our efficiency, corruption breaks down assurance and confidence in our system.
Corruption is a criminal offence and deserves punishment. By enforcing punishing these criminals, we reassure those who lost confidence that we, as Government, will not tolerate any wrongdoing towards our citizenry.
The MF says: Stamp out corruption. We will not tolerate it in South Africa. We are a united people. Let’s unite against corruption. The provisions are well-structured in this Bill, and it is hoped that it will be implemented firmly. The MF supports the Prevention and Combating of Corrupt Activities Bill. Thank you. [Applause.]
Ms F I CHOHAN-KHOTA: Chairperson, when the ANC came to power in 1994 and brought to this country its first democracy, it inherited a country in which corruption was rife. The pre-1994 state mechanisms to prevent, or deal with, crime and corruption, were unstructured, ineffective, incoherent and therefore completely useless. In this environment, crime, and in particular corruption thrived. Therefore, it is very surprising and rather rich for somebody like Sheila Camerer, who was so intimately associated with that era, to stand here today and tell us how to deal with corruption.
What propped up that vile administration and state if not “corruption at the highest levels”, as she put it? The hon Camerer is being completely and blatantly dishonest when she suggests that we in the ANC dragged our feet in implementing anticorruption measures. What did the apartheid government in which you … Oh, I see she is not here. So, I am not sure why she laments the absence of Patricia de Lille when her own commitment is so very questionable. [Interjections.]
Mr D H M GIBSON: That’s a bit unfair, you know.
Ms F I CHOHAN-KHOTA: The ANC Government has done more in ten years, Mr Gibson, than has ever been done in the history of this country to fight corruption, and you know it, and she knows it as well. [Interjections.] Very early on, the ANC’s approach … [Interjections.] I am going to show why I am saying what I am saying.
Very early on, the ANC’s approach was to improve and strengthen our legislative arsenal, as well as our crime-busting institutions. In this regard I am indebted to the Minister, who in his speech has referred to some of the measures we have taken in the last few years.
Mrs Camerer has spoken of their party’s commitment from 2001. Let me go well back to 1995 and 1997 when … [Interjections.] It is not going to help to shout, because you should listen, then maybe you will learn something about what it is that we are doing to fight corruption. [Interjections.]
Various innovative amendments were effected to our bail laws so that when an accused is charged with corruption in excess of R500 000, he bears the onus of proving to the court that the interests of justice dictate his release on bail.
Dis eintlik ‘n baie streng boodskap, Mnr Groenewald … [It is actually a very strong message, Mr Groenewald …]
… who is also not here. Again, in 1996, this Government passed the Proceeds of Crime Act. This Act allows the state to confiscate money or property forming the proceeds of crime. This took profit away from crime.
There is another one: the Prevention of Organised Crime Act. The Government also established many crime-busting institutions, such as the SIUs and special tribunals, which were refined by the Act that we passed in this House in 1995 called the Investigation of Serious Economic Offences Act. We passed the International Co-operation in Criminal Matters Act in 1996 already. Within the NDPP’s office, there exists dedicated directorates, directed towards combating corruption specifically. These are just some of the initiatives of this Government since 1994, and basically to suggests that the ANC has been inconsistent in its attempts to try and eradicate this scourge, is completely and utterly untrue.
What our President is on record as saying, is that the ANC will root out corruption and will display zero tolerance toward those who seek to erode our accomplishments as a people. But having said that, it must be kept in mind that the big difference between us and the DA is that the ANC is always mindful that in whatever we do, the rule of law must be upheld first and foremost.
It is not becoming of us, as a people, to display frenzied glee and begin frothing at the mouth at the mere allegation of corruption. As a people, we have committed ourselves to a higher, more profound value than that. I thought we had become more civilised since the days when certain people were burnt at the stake without any recourse or scope for due process.
Innocent until proven guilty is a living commitment that all democrats must cherish. It is to the advantage of our country, our people and our future that we jealously guard its survival. I thank you. [Applause.]
The MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Chairperson, essentially I am rising to thank all the representatives of the various parties who have spoken in support of this very important Bill. Thank you indeed, hon members.
Quite a number of speakers, particularly from the ANC, have expressed their concern that the hon Sheila Camerer is not here. I want to assure the hon members that she has not gone to have her hair done. She has a very important public task to perform and she wrote to me about it. If it pleases you, Chairperson and hon members, I am going to read the love letter I got from her, and it reads as follows:
Dear Pennuel, I apologise for not staying for your reply, but my son is getting married on Saturday and I have a houseful of guests. Regards, Sheila.
It’s a very important public task, indeed.
Firstly, I think we should state for the record that there is no document before any court in the Republic of South Africa in which the Deputy President of the Republic of South Africa is implicated in the commission of crime. [Interjections.]
Mr D H M GIBSON: That’s quite right.
The MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: We should state that for the record. It would indeed be very sad if his name was mentioned in a charge sheet or an indictment, but, the truth, hon members, is that the Deputy President has not been charged with the commission of any offence, and it behoves us, as leaders, to state these basic truths for the erudition of our own followers. It doesn’t serve any useful purpose to pretend that there is indeed a problem in that regard. You won’t find any such document anywhere.
Secondly, it strikes me indeed that whilst the hon Sheila Camerer gives, quite rightly so, a long catalogue of actions that have been taken by the ANC-led Government on the issue of corruption against individuals as well as certain institutions, including, unhappily so, elements of my own department, what she doesn’t say is who has taken this action against them.
But, before I come to that, I also want to say that we have given part of the catalogue of laws and, indeed, mechanisms that this Government has established to deal with this problem. Now, with all that knowledge, it really surprises some of us that there are still people who believe that there is a lack of will on the part of Government. The hon member even quoted me out of turn to try and substantiate this palpable falsehood.
The truth is that I was not speaking about the lack of will on the part of my Government because I knew what the Government was doing when I made that statement. I was talking about the need for all governments to act robustly against the issue of corruption. I wasn’t saying mine was not acting. We have a very long and impressive record of what we have done on the issue of corruption and related activities since 1994. Those who have eyes will see it. Those who have ears will listen to this and at least, unless they have evidence to the contrary, will accept the earnest resolve of my Government to deal with this problem. We are dealing with it, and indeed we are getting on top of it.
It doesn’t serve any useful purpose to try and score political points, especially when you are going to rely on falsehoods. We are acting against it. For us there is no untouchable. We have not spared anyone. When there is probable cause to act against a person, no matter where he or she is located, we take appropriate action, and that is correct. Thank you very much. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
Bill read a second time.
CONSIDERATION OF NATIONAL ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT: PROTECTED AREAS BILL
There was no debate.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move: That the Bill be agreed to.
Thank you.
Motion agreed to.
Bill accordingly agreed to.
CONSIDERATION OF ENVIRONMENT CONSERVATION AMENDMENT BILL
There was no debate.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Bill be agreed to.
Thank you.
Motion agreed to.
Bill accordingly agreed to.
CONSIDERATION OF RESTITUTION OF LAND RIGHTS AMENDMENT BILL
Mr D M DLALI: Chairperson, in introducing this amendment, I just want to raise one or two issues. Firstly, we have been advised that AgriSA, with Nafu and other stakeholders, are fully behind and support this amendment, in terms of clause 5, which also indicates, in terms of section 3 of the Promotion of Administrative Justice Act, that we, therefore, support it on the basis that it is going to deal with a number of developmental issues and will also contribute to the betterment of our communities in various areas. Thank you, Chairperson.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Bill be agreed to.
Thank you.
Declarations of vote: Mnr A J BOTHA: Voorsitter, hierdie wetsontwerp is net so onderduims gehanteer soos gister se verkiesing van die Pan-Afrikaanse parlementslede, waartydens die ANC ‘n apartheidsargitek aan Afrika opgedwing het, in plaas van ‘n Afrika-argitek soos Colin Eglin, wat 40 jaar van sy lewe gewy het aan die herstel van die menseregte van al hierdie ANC-lede wat hier sit. [Tussenwerpsels.]
Waarskynlik moet dit niemand verbaas dat die nuwe skenders van menseregte die vorige skenders beloon vir hulle kundige dienstigheid in hierdie verband nie. Die skending waarvan ons praat is die drakoniese magte wat hierdie wetsontwerp wil gee aan die Minister vir Landbou en Grondsake om te besluit wie is die regmatige eienaar van enige stuk grond, op enige plek in Suid-Afrika, en AgriSA steun nie daardie kwessie nie, wat ‘n mens ook al daarvan mag dink.
Dit is ‘n fundamentele aanval op die regstaat en geen paneelkloppery van stertjies of angels kan dit verbeter, soos die besondere onkundige Nuwe NP naprater van die ANC in die ander Huis gereeld probeer voorgee nie. Vir diesulkes en hulle imbongis se kennisname: moord kan nie verbeter word deur met stertjies en angeltjies te toor nie. As jy iemand se kop afkap, is sy kop af, of die byl nou stomp of skerp was.
Voordat die agb President die DA weer soos gewoonlik beskuldig van rassisme, omdat ons kwansuis net bekommerd is oor wit regte, het ek vir hom ‘n stukkie opgedateerde nuus. Die DA sal net so hard spook vir die menseregte van kommunale boere wanneer die ANC probeer om die Minister soortgelyke diskresionêre magte te gee om te besluit wie is regmatige eienaars in kommunale gebied en wie is nie.
Dit is verblydend dat organisasies soos die SA Raad van Kerke en die Legal Resource Centre, en andere, dieselfde mening huldig. Maar ons wil dit onder hulle aandag bring dat ook hulle nie dubbele standaarde moet handhaaf nie. [Tussenwerpsels.] Die onaanvaarbare diskressionêre magte wat die Communal Land Rights Bill aan die Minister wil gee, kon alreeds in die kiem gesmoor gewees het tydens die openbare verhore van die Wetsontwerp op Restitusie, maar toe was hulle stil hieroor. Die les wat hieruit geleer moet word, is dat regte op beginsels berus en nie op dienstigheid of vooroordele nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[Mr A J BOTHA: Chairperson, this Bill has been dealt with in an underhand manner, as was the election of the members of the Pan-African Parliament yesterday, during which the ANC forced an architect of apartheid on Africa, instead of an architect of Africa like Colin Eglin, who dedicated 40 years of his life to the restitution of the human rights of all these ANC members who are sitting here. [Interjections.]
It should probably surprise nobody that the new violators of human rights are rewarding the previous violators for their skilful expediency in this regard. The violation we are referring to is the draconian powers that this Bill seeks to give the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs to decide who is the rightful owner of any piece of land, anywhere in South Africa, and AgriSA does not support that, whatever one may think of it.
It is a fundamental attack on the legal state, and no panelbeating of tails and stings can improve it, as the extremely ignorant New NP yes-man of the ANC in the other House regularly tries to suggest it does. For the information of such people and their imbongis: murder cannot be improved upon by juggling tails and stings. If you chop off someone’s head, his head is off, whether the axe was sharp or blunt.
Before the hon President accuses the DA of racism as usual, because we are ostensibly only concerned about the rights of white people, I have an updated newsflash for him. The DA will struggle just as hard for the human rights of communal farmers when the ANC tries to give the Minister similar discretionary powers to decide who are the rightful owners in communal areas, and who are not.
It is heartening that organisations such as the SA Council of Churches and the Legal Resource Centre, and others, are of the same opinion. But we want to bring it to their attention that they should not practise double standards either. [Interjections.] The unacceptable discretionary powers that the Communal Land Rights Bill seeks to give the Minister, could have been nipped in the bud during the public hearings of the restitution Bill, but they kept quiet about this then. The lesson to be learnt from this is that the rights are based on principles and not on expediency or prejudice.]
Great structures can remain standing for millennia, or they can be destroyed suddenly by cataclysmic events, or they can be destroyed by slow decay on account of neglect and pilfering. The action of this Parliament today is most decidedly in the latter category. Those colluding in this pilfering of principle will be branded by history, just as certainly as those who colluded in the crime of apartheid are forever branded by it.
The DA rejects this Bill and we will in future reject the Communal Land Rights Bill for as long as it undermines the rule of law by diminishing the basic human rights of the communal landowners. [Applause.]
Dr A I VAN NIEKERK: Agb Voorsitter, die feit dat daar restitusie moet plaasvind in Suid-Afrika word algemeen gesteun en aanvaar. Dit is nie in dispuut nie. Wat wel in dispuut is, is die wyse waarvolgens dit moet geskied.
Die wysigingswetsontwerp skep nuwe magte vir die Minister van Landbou en Grondsake om grond weg te neem van een eienaar en dit aan ‘n nuwe eienaar te gee sonder dat dit deur ‘n hof beoordeel, en deur ‘n regsuitspraak gemagtig word. Die doel voorgehou vir hierdie magte aan die Minister is dat dit die verkryging van grond vir restitusie doeleindes sal versnel om so die hele proses te bespoedig. Die FA is van mening dat juis die teenoorgestelde sal gebeur, naamlik, dat die proses aansienlik vertraag kan word as gevolg van dispute wat agterna deur ‘n regsproses uitgeklaar moet word, omdat dit nie aan die begin deur ‘n hof uitgeklaar is nie.
Die probleem is nie die verkryging van grond nie, maar om die legitieme eienaarskap van individue en groepe eisers wat aanspraak maak op grond te bepaal, en om die gevolglike oordra van eienaarskap op ‘n vaste regsuitspraak te vestig. Voorheen is die proses deur ‘n regter in ‘n hof uitgevoer, maar word nou, volgens die wysigingswet, aan die Minister en die Departement van Landbou en Grondsake oorgedra om oor te besluit en uit te voer.
Met alle respek teenoor die Minister, maar die politieke hoof van ‘n departement is nie in regsake opgelei nie, en so ook nie die Departement van Grondsake nie, om voldoende sekerheid te gee aan so ‘n ingewikkelde proses van onteiening deur hulle besluite, en dit sonder ‘n hofstempel daarop. Die gevolg hiervan sal wees dat indien daar ‘n dispuut oor die eienaarskap is, of indien die proses betwis word, sal die aangeleentheid in elk geval na ‘n hof verwys word vir uitspraak. Sou dit gebeur, en dit sal gebeur, sal dit die proses nog verder vertraag.
Die beginsel in die wysigingswetsonwerp vervat, maak van die Minister en die Departement van Landbou en Grondsake die ondersoeker, die beoordelaar, die toekenner en die regter om restitusie deur te voer. Dit is nie aanvaarbaar nie. Dit is onaanvaarbaar, en nie goed genoeg vir die regsproses en demokrasie om soveel mag in die hande van een persoon of Minister te plaas nie.
Die FA is teen die wysigingswetsontwerp gekant. (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)
[Dr A I VAN NIEKERK: Hon Chairperson, the fact that restitution has to take place in South Africa is generally supported and accepted. That is not in dispute. What is in dispute is the manner in which it should take place.
The amending Bill creates new powers for the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs to take land away from one owner and give it to another without the matter being judged by a court and authorised by a legal judgment. The reason for giving these powers to the Minister is that it will speed up the acquisition of land for the purposes of restitution in order to expedite the entire process. The FA is of the opinion that precisely the opposite will happen, namely that the process could be significantly delayed as a result of disputes having to be resolved by way of a legal process afterwards because matters were not being cleared up by a court to begin with.
The problem is not the acquisition of land, but determining the legitimate ownership of individuals and groups of claimants laying claim to land, and basing the consequent transfer of ownership on a firm legal judgment. Previously, this process was carried out by a judge in a court but, according to the amending Bill, it is now being transferred to the Minister and the Department of Agriculture and Land Affairs to decide upon and implement.
With all due respect to the Minister, the political head of a department is not trained in legal matters, and neither is the Department of Land Affairs, in order to provide such a complicated process of expropriation with sufficient certainty through their decisions, and that without the approval of a court. The consequence of this will be that if there is a dispute about the ownership, or if the process is contested, the matter will be referred to a court for a judgment in any case. If this happens, and it will happen, it will delay the process even further.
The principle contained in the amending Bill makes the Minister and the Department of Agriculture and Land Affairs the investigator, the assessor, the allocator and the judge to carry out restitution. That is not acceptable. It is unacceptable, and not good enough for the legal process and democracy to place so much power in the hands of one person or Minister.
The FA opposes the amending Bill.]
Mr M V NGEMA: Chairperson, the IFP is grateful to the DA for giving us this opportunity to inform the House that the amendment by the NCOP was first introduced during the meeting by the IFP of the Portfolio Committee on Agriculture and Land Affairs. The IFP introduced this very amendment, but it was rejected. It took the NCOP to drive the sense home. The IFP supports this amendment, even now. [Applause.]
Mnr S ABRAM: Agb Voorsitter, ons in die ANC steun natuurlik hierdie wysiging wat deur die NRVP aanvaar is.
Ek wil net graag aan die agb Raad sê dat die agb lid Botha van die DA al voorheen beweer het dat die Parlement met hierdie wetgewing omseil word. Hier kry dieselfde agb lid, op sy eie aandrang, weer ‘n geleentheid om in die Parlement daaroor te praat. Kan dit wees dat agb Botha nie Suid-Afrika se Grondwet ken nie? Die een wat hy plegtig, met ‘n handtekening daarby, onderneem het om te bevorder en te beskerm? Of is hy juis doelbewus besig om met hierdie uitsprake teen die Grondwet atmosfeer te skep?
Die beginsels vir die onteiening van grond in die openbare belang is juis in hierdie Grondwet se artikel 25 vasgepen. Of steun die agb Botha nou nie meer die Grondwet as die land se hoogste wet nie? Die DA se gemaklike samewerking met regse elemente, soos die verkrampte Transvaalse Landbou- unie en selfs die ou wit vakbond, die Blanke Mynwerkers-unie, wat nou sy naam na Solidariteit verander het, is ook blootgestel toe die TLU- afvaardiging sy voorleggings kom doen het, en net die DA se wit parlementslede met sy vertrek, voor ons almal se oë, gegroet het.
Mnr Andries Botha, die DA woordvoerder, het onder andere gesê die veranderinge is kosmeties. Sy regse bedmaatjies, die Transvaalse Landbou- unie, het hom gesteun, en verskil skerp van die Regering se plan met dié wetsontwerp. Mnr Willie Lewies, die voorsitter van die TLU se eiendomsregkomitee, het aan koerante bevestig dat die TLU in beginsel steeds alle grondeise gaan teenstaan, en glo dat alle grond, ook dorpserwe, nou onteien kan word.
Op ‘n webwerf noem die TLU alle onteiening “grondroof” en u heul saam met hulle. Hoe roof ‘n mens iemand se grond as jy hom daarvoor billik gaan vergoed, want in hierdie wysiging word verwys na die bepalings van ‘n administratiewe regsproses, ‘n wet? [Tussenwerpsels.] Tog lyk dit of die TLU en die DA in so ‘n siening verenig is. Onteiening kan tog hoogstens as ‘n gedwonge verkoopstransaksie beskou word, en nie die teësinnige afvat van grond soos wat in Die Beeld en Die Burger al berig is nie. [Tussenwerpsels.]
Mnr Botha, die DA se woordvoerder oor landbou, sê dit is onsinnig om die Minister die reg te gee om te besluit oor die gematigdheid van eise. In Pretoria is daar huise wat al etlike dekades staan, en wat nou onteien kan word, so beweer Mnr Botha. Mnr Botha reken die blote moontlikheid dat dit kan gebeur, is nadelig vir beleggersvertroue en vir reg en orde.
Laastens moet daar iets gesê word oor die DA se segsman oor grondsake, die agb Dan Maluleke. Ons het hom leer ken as iemand wat insig het en begrip toon vir die penarie van derduisende burgers teen wie al gediskrimineer is. Maar dit lyk asof sy landbou-ampsgenoot, die agb Botha, nie na goeie raad van hom kan luister nie. Miskien sal die agb Maluleke tuiser wees in ‘n party wat nie deur ‘n blanke oormag oorheers word nie, soos die DA. [Tyd verstreke.] [Applous.] (Translation of Afrikaans speech follows.)
[Mr S ABRAM: Hon Chairperson, we in the ANC obviously support this amendment as adopted by the NCOP.
I would just like to tell the hon House that the hon member Botha of the DA has alleged before that Parliament is being circumvented with this legislation. Here the same member, at his own insistence, is getting another opportunity to discuss it in Parliament. Could it be that the hon Botha is not acquainted with the South African Constitution? The one that he, with an accompanying signature, solemnly swore to promote and protect? Or is he deliberately trying to create a negative atmosphere around the Constitution with these remarks?
The principles pertaining to the expropriation of land in the public interest are in fact entrenched in section 25 of this Constitution. Or does the hon Botha no longer support the Constitution as the highest law of the land? The DA’s convenient co-operation with rightwing elements, such as the ultra-conservative Tranvaal Agricultural Union and even the old white trade union, the White Mineworkers Union, which has now changed its name to Solidarity, was also exposed when the TAU delegation came to make its submissions, and only greeted the DA’s white parliamentary members when they departed, in full view of us all.
Mr Andries Botha, the DA spokesperson said, inter alia, that the changes are cosmetic. His rightwing bedfellows, the Transvaal Agricultural Union, supported him and disagree sharply with the Government’s plan with this Bill. Mr Willie Lewies, the chairperson of the TAU’s land tenure committee, has confirmed to newspapers that the TAU will in principle continue to oppose all land claims, and believes that all land, even urban plots, can now be expropriated.
On a website the TAU calls all expropriation land robbery and you are collaborating with them. How do you rob a person of his land, if you are going to offer him fair compensation, because in this amendment reference is made to the provisions of an administrative legal process, an Act? [Interjections.] Yet it would seem that the TAU and the DA are united in this view. Expropriation can, at best, be regarded as a forced sales transaction, and not the grudging taking away of land as has already been reported in Die Beeld and Die Burger. [Interjections.]
Mr Botha, the DA’s spokesperson on agriculture, says it is absurd to give the Minister the right to decide on the legality of claims. Mr Botha is alleging that houses in Pretoria, which have been standing for several decades, can now be expropriated. Mr Botha is of the opinion that the mere possibility that this could happen is bad for investor confidence and law and order.
In conclusion, let me say something about the DA’s spokesperson on land affairs, the hon Dan Maluleke. We have got to know him as someone who has shown insight and understanding for the predicament of thousands upon thousands of citizens who have suffered discrimination. But it seems as if his agriculture colleague, the hon Botha, is unable to listen to his good advice. Perhaps the hon Maluleke would be more at home in a party that is not dominated by a white majority, like the DA. [Time expired.] [Applause.]]
The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon Millin, I had recognised your hand but when I looked in your direction you were busy caucusing with the NA. So, I had to give the opportunity to the ANC. I’m sorry about that.
Motion agreed to (Democratic Alliance, Independent African Movement, Freedom Front, Federal Alliance and National Action dissenting).
Bill accordingly agreed to.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF AD HOC COMMITTEE ON
PUBLIC AUDITING FUNCTION Mr V G SMITH: Chairperson, the Ad Hoc Committee on Public Auditing Function was established by resolution of the House and mandated to introduce a Bill on the objects contained in the legislative proposal reviewing the auditing function, which was submitted to the Speaker by the Audit Commission.
The committee received and considered submissions from stakeholders and thereafter conducted public hearings. The committee also consulted widely, amongst others, with the Chairperson of the Joint Standing Committee on Intelligence, the Chairperson of the Portfolio Committee on Defence, the Auditor-General, the Speaker of the National Assembly, the Presidency, the national Department of Defence, the SAPS, the National Treasury and the national Department of Intelligence.
The Public Audit Bill that we are introducing in the House gives effect to section 55(2), section 181(3) and section 188 of our Constitution. The Bill is further proof of this Government’s resolve to deepen and protect our democracy.
The Bill also seeks to improve the efficiency and effectiveness of the Office of the Auditor-General. In introducing this Bill, we recommend that members of this House be accorded an opportunity to debate the Bill. Thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC SERVICE AND
ADMINISTRATION - PROVINCIAL VISITS
There was no debate.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF JOINT MONITORING COMMITTEE ON IMPROVEMENT OF QUALITY OF LIFE AND STATUS OF WOMEN - REPORT OF THE INDEPENDENT EXPERTS’ ASSESSMENT ON WOMEN, WAR AND PEACE (UNIFEM)
There was no debate.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
CONSIDERATION OF NINETY-FOURTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC
ACCOUNTS - DEPARTMENT OF WATER AFFAIRS AND FORESTRY
There was no debate.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move:
That the Report be adopted.
Motion agreed to.
Report accordingly adopted.
RULE OF ANTICIPATION
(Ruling)
The SPEAKER: Hon members, before we proceed, I have to give a ruling. On 18 November, the hon Mrs Van Wyk made a statement on the proposed appointments to the SABC Board, a matter that had been specifically scheduled for consideration by the House on the following day, 19 November. The Deputy Chief Whip of the Majority Party subsequently, on a point of order, asked whether the hon Mrs Van Wyk’s statement was not in breach of the Rule of Anticipation. Member’s statements, as an element of the proceedings of the House are necessarily subject to the Rules of Debate.
The Rule of Anticipation, that’s Rule 68, states that no member may anticipate the discussion on a matter appearing on the Order Paper. It provides further that the Chair, in determining whether a discussion is out of order on the grounds of anticipation, shall have regard to the probability that the matter anticipated will come before the House within a reasonable time.
I’ve always held the view that there should be as few restrictions as possible on members’ right to freedom of speech and in applying the Rules I’ve always tried to exercise my discretion accordingly. Members should note, however, that the Rule of Anticipation, in essence, does not prevent members from airing their views but requires them to make their input at an appropriate time.
In this specific case of the hon Mrs Van Wyk’s statement, she was clearly anticipating the discussion scheduled for the following day, and was pre- empting that discussion for which debating time had been allocated. I’m therefore in agreement with the hon Deputy Chief Whip of the Majority Party that the hon Mrs Van Wyk’s statement was in breach of the Rules.
It will serve no purpose for me to request her to retract the statement after the event. I would, however, appeal to members, generally, to observe the Rule of Anticipation when making statements and to raise a point of order when they think a member is transgressing the Rule.
Members’ statements are a new feature of our proceedings and in the establishing of good practice, the Chair will apply the Rule of Anticipation to members’ statements in circumstances where there is a clear opportunity in the near future for a member to make his or her input on the particular subject.
I am giving this ruling as a guide to members. It’s not to ask for any withdrawal, as I have said, and I would appreciate it if in future this matter will be dealt with and members will take heed and Whips will guide their members. I know there is a long recess coming, so when you come back maybe you can guide your members and make sure that we do not transgress on the Rule.
I’m sure, Mr Gibson, you are going to be practising your whipping techniques during the recess. [Interjections.] Perhaps that’s an appropriate time, hon members, to come to farewell speeches.
FAREWELL SPEECHES
Mr D H M GIBSON: Madam Speaker, I rise to express my good wishes to colleagues in all parts of the House, including the interjector there. This has been a busy year and the election, which I understand is taking place on 31 March 2004, means that holidays and relaxation will be short. Even some of our less energetic colleagues will join the rest of us who are keen constituency MPs and reach out to those whom we represent or aspire to represent.
This year has been packed with activity, sensation and political controversy, all of which are the lifeblood of politics and of Parliament. I must say that in most respects Government and opposition Whips have co- operated well, and I thank our colleagues in the Whippery for their courtesy and consideration.
My friend, the hon ANC Chief Whip, rules with a light hand and his deputy is most hardworking and attentive, and we appreciate the efforts he puts in. We have no difficulties on a personal basis with any of the ANC Whips and regard many of them as friends. The same may be said of the Whips of all other parties.
What a pity it is that the ANC political leadership made the year end on a very sour note. Instead of the launch of the Pan-African Parliament being a glad occasion for all South Africans, we saw a sham election which rewarded an MP for providing the sort of opposition which the ANC prefers.
I hope that after the elections, if the ANC is returned to power, it will resist abusing that power any further, because democracy is still a fragile plant in our country. Sometimes the wise move - and the wise thing to do - is to refrain from exercising the power which you have.
I am glad that I missed yesterday’s meeting of the joint rules committee. According to all reports, it was a meeting which achieved too little. Ten years into democracy we really should have been further along the road for having a proper professional meeting which achieves concrete results.
Documents are often late or inadequate. Decisions are delayed, often because the parties themselves delay matters by failing to do their homework. Sometimes decisions are not carried out or are insufficiently clear. I want to suggest that we should consider having action minutes instead of narrative minutes. It is all wonderful to read five years later what Gibson said, or what this one or that one said. What is much more important is what was decided and who was supposed to do something by what date, so that when one gets to the next meeting and if action has not been taken, you can say the New NP is the only party which has failed to do its homework and they therefore delayed the decision - and put the blame where it belongs, instead of just saying, ``the parties have failed to do what they should have done’’. I really think that in that way we will inject some more professionalism into this whole thing.
I want to say that at the end of a year we have the opportunity of saying farewell to each other. We also have the opportunity, I understand, of saying farewell to the former leader of the PAC. I understand that hon Stanley Mogoba is soon going to be leaving us, and I want to wish him well. He is a decent and nice man and I don’t think the PAC deserved him. We have an opportunity of thanking the presiding officers and we are very grateful for what you do for us, also generally ruling with a relatively light hand. We thank the parliamentary officials who serve us and through us, the people of South Africa. Most of them, not all of them, do so willingly and cheerfully. I want to thank them at all levels, right from the top to the bottom.
It remains for me to wish all of you in this Chamber a happy and a healthy holiday and some good quality time with friends, with family and with all those who love you. [Applause.]
Mrs S A SEATON: Madam Speaker and hon members, we have come to the end of yet another year and almost the end of another term of office. This past year has been a difficult year for most people and this last term a particularly difficult period with many emotions running high.
There is still much unfinished business in this Parliament at this stage. There is still a sad lack of understanding by those who decide on financial priorities of Parliament, who still cannot grasp the plight of members with regard to adequate resources to be able to carry out their responsibilities as members of Parliament both here and in their constituencies.
But there have also been achievements, and let us rather for the moment dwell on them. Time does not permit me to say too much, except to express my appreciation to the many who deserve our thanks. There is a great tendency in this world for individuals to take full credit for what they have achieved in life, for the successes in particular, and to put blame elsewhere when things go wrong.
In truth, there are few if any persons who can claim total acclaim for anything good that has happened, for there is always bound to be someone who has assisted along the way to make it happen - the secretary that typed the vital letter, the service officer who saw to it that the letter was delivered, the legal adviser who assisted in determining the legalities of the matter, the colleagues from other parties who supported a proposal, even our adversaries who, if nothing else, gave us food for thought. The point is that we often take for granted the contribution others make in our lives and in our successes. We forget that they too have been part of it and have succeeded as well.
Today, as we bid each other farewell for the year, I would like to thank the many people who have contributed to my life and to the lives of parliamentarians over this past year: the presiding officers - Madam Speaker, Madam Deputy Speaker, the Chairman of Committees, who is to be congratulated on making major changes over the past year and many improvements that have been introduced to assist this Parliament; the Chief Whip and the Deputy Chief Whip of the ANC for their co-operation over the past year; programming Whips; Whips of other parties; and members of staff of the Chief Whips’ Forum. Our opinion is that the Chief Whips’ Forum has done great things over this past year and together we have achieved a great deal.
I thank the Secretary to Parliament and the Secretary to the National Assembly and their staff members. Perhaps I should even mention Mr Mansura and Ms Griebenouw because they are people that have done a great deal for us. The parliamentary legal advisers and many people, such as the Chief Financial Officer, that have done a lot to change things in this Parliament, and I thank everybody else. When I say everybody, I mean catering staff, service officers, everybody.
Thank you all for your contributions over the past year, a difficult and complex year, a controversial year, as we have already heard. The floor- crossing gave many people much more than a few headaches, I am sure. But, people continued to contribute with a smile. Each and every contribution has helped whatever successes have been achieved, and we thank you all.
As we reach election mode, let us all put into practice the words of the great poet, Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, when he wrote:
One virtue stands out above all others The constant striving upwards, wrestling with oneself,
The constant desire for purity, wisdom, goodness and love.
May we all live as such, striving upwards, wrestling with ourselves, having the constant desire for purity, wisdom, goodness and love.
May I, on behalf of the IFP, wish you all a safe journey, wish you and your families a joyous and blessed Christmas, and may the peace and joy of God be with you throughout the recess and Christmas period. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr C H F GREYLING: Madam Speaker, at the end of the second democratic Parliament’s fifth session, it is my pleasure to say a few words of thanks on behalf of the New NP and to convey our season’s greetings.
Die afgelope jaar was ‘n besonder betekenisvolle jaar, waarin die Parlement steeds verder sy eie karakter ontwikkel het; ‘n jaar waarin daar weer eens oomblikke van plegtigheid en oomblikke van erns was, maar ook tye van skerp debat en gelukkig ook van gesonde humor wat aan die orde van die dag was. [The past year was an exceptionally significant year in which Parliament developed its own character even further; a year in which there were once again solemn moments, serious moments, but also times where sharp debate and luckily even healthy humour were the order of the day.]
The fact that the parliamentary process, as a whole, ran like a well-oiled machine is, however, not only because of the members but also because of the hard work of a diverse group of people. Therefore, we want to thank them and express our appreciation.
Namens my party, wil ek graag aan alle lede dank betuig met wie ons in debat kon tree - soms vriendelik en soms krities - en waar die debatte soms hewig was, het ons dit egter almal met een doel voor oë gedoen en dit is omdat elkeen van ons wil hê dat ons van Suid-Afrika ‘n suksesvolle land wil maak. Waar ons met die hoofsweep van die amptelike opposisie soms hewig verskil, maar dit is ‘n gewoonte wat mens nie kan afleer nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[On behalf of my party, I wish to extend thanks to all members with whom we could enter into debate - sometimes friendly and sometimes critical - and where the debates were sometimes heated, we all did it with one goal in mind and that was because each one of us wants to make South Africa a successful country. We sometimes differ markedly with the Chief Whip of the Official Opposition, but that is a habit which cannot be broken.]
It is my pleasure to thank the Speaker, Deputy Speaker, Chairperson of Committees and Deputy Chairperson of Committees for the manner in which you managed the Chair, sometimes under very difficult circumstances, especially during the past year with the number of parties increasing from 13 to 17, which complicated matters even more.
Our thanks go to the Chief Whip and the Deputy Chief Whip of the Majority Party for the co-operation we enjoyed in specific forums. I would also like to thank the Whips of all the other parties for the collegiality that exists between us.
To the Secretary to Parliament, the Secretary of the National Assembly, Table and service personnel, caterers, security personnel, including those who seem to have a tendency to bang the boots and bonnets of our cars in the morning, our thanks and appreciation.
Aan die media wat ‘n belangrike rol speel om die Parlement se werk aan die gemeenskap daar buite bekend te stel, wil ons ook graag ons dank en waardering betuig. Ten slotte is dit vir my aangenaam om aan u een en almal ‘n vreugdevolle, rustige en veilige feestydperk toe te wens. Mag 2004 vir u almal voorspoed, vrede en geluk inhou. Ek dank u. [Applous.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)
[To the media who play a vital role in introducing Parliament’s work to the community at large, we would also like to express our gratitude and appreciation. In conclusion, it is a pleasure to wish one and all a joyous, peaceful and safe festival season. May 2004 bring prosperity, peace and happiness to all of you. I thank you. [Applause.]]
Mr L M GREEN: Madam Speaker, I am sure that all of us, and especially those MPs who have had a very large workload, are gratefully relieved today that we have come to the end of a very busy session. This session was exceptionally challenging to many of us, if you consider the many hours we spent preparing our speeches, attending portfolio committee meetings to discuss legislation and the many other tasks thrust upon us as MPs.
The time has come for us to take a much-needed break from our busy schedules. Our parliamentary debates have often been very robust, but we thank God that the situation never reached the level of robustness experienced in the Taiwanese parliament. Yes, we have had moments in this House when a strident MP would hit below the belt, especially when the referee or the Speaker is not looking. But, usually such an MP is brought to order and reminded to fight according to the rules. Despite our robust and strident behaviour as MPs, we leave this House with the knowledge - like good sportsmen and women - that we bear no grudges against the governing party or any other opposition party.
We are mindful that all of us are in Parliament to represent our constituencies; to speak for those who have elected us. By April next year, we will know how well we have articulated the views of our supporters. Let us not encourage the loose talk from the public, when they say MPs are lazy and are riding on a gravy train. Only the uninformed will hold such a view. Now is the time to give more quality time to our family members and loved ones. Now is the time to do those many improvements at home which we have been pushing to the back of our minds.
In conclusion, let me wish you a well-deserved rest. My sincere thanks to the presiding officers, Madam Speaker and Deputy Speaker, the Chairperson and Deputy Chairperson of Committees. You have managed Parliament very well despite the robustness of this House. I wish to thank all the Chief Whips, the Whips, the parliamentary staff, the Table staff and all the service sectors. We really appreciate your hard work. May you all rest well during the Christmas holidays and come back next year refreshed, and we trust God will keep you and your family members safe throughout the recess.
The ACDP wishes Bishop Mogoba of the PAC well in his retirement. May the peace of God remain with us until we meet again. I thank you. [Applause.]
Mr P J GROENEWALD: Madam Speaker, we are yet again at the end of another parliamentary year, and then I think of the words of Winston Churchill when he said that the only difference between war and politics is that in war you are killed only once, but in politics many times. So hon members will know how many times they were killed during this parliamentary year. And the FF Plus wants to say good luck for what lies ahead. I can actually congratulate you on having survived this political year.
Maar, agb Speaker, ek wil ook namens ons hoofsweep ons dank en waardering uitspreek jeens die amptenare vir hul deel wat hulle gelewer het, hul bydraes. Uit die aard van die saak is niks volmaak nie, maar dit is altyd lekker om teen die einde van die jaar te kom dankie sê vir dít wat gedoen is. Ons wil ook graag namens die Vryheidsfront vir die lede van die Suid- Afrikaanse Polisiediens, wat eintlik sorg dat ons kan veilig wees hier binnekant - ek weet nie, as ons partymaal kyk na sommige lede se reaksies, weet ons nie of hulle ‘n groter gevaar vir hulself óf vir mekaar is nie - dankie sê vir hul dienste wat gelewer is.
Ook wat die media betref, moet ons vir mekaar as parlementariërs sê dat as die media nie ons boodskap uitdra nie, ons boodskap nie by ons mense gaan uitkom nie, en daarom van ons kant af ook baie dankie vir die bydrae van die media. Ek aanvaar sommige toesprake mag vir hulle baie vervelig wees, sommige kan baie amusant wees, maar minstens dra hulle ook die boodskap uit na buite. Ons dank en waardering daarvoor.
Van die Vryheidsfront wil ons elke agb lid ‘n geseënde Kersfees toewens vorentoe. Mag u ‘n ware Christusfees beleef, en mag u volgende jaar almal veilig terugkom, én mag ons almal ‘n voorspoedige Nuwejaar hê. Baie dankie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)
[But, hon Speaker, on behalf of our Chief Whip I want to express our thanks and appreciation to the officials for doing their share, for their contributions. Naturally nothing is perfect, but at the end of the year it is always a pleasure to come and say thank you for what has been done. On behalf of the Freedom Front we would like to say thank you to the members of the South African Police Service, who in fact ensure that we are safe in here - I don’t know, sometimes when we look at some members’ reactions, we do not know if they are a greater danger to themselves or to one another - for the services they have rendered.
With regard to the media, we must also tell one another as parliamentarians that if the media do not convey our message, our message will not reach the people, and therefore we want to say thank you very much for the contribution of the media. I accept that they might find some speeches very boring, some can be very amusing, but at least they also carry the message to the outside. Our thanks and appreciation for that.
On behalf of the Freedom Front we want to wish every hon member a blessed Christmas. May you experience a true feast of Christ, and may you all return safely next year, and may all of us have a prosperous New Year. Thank you very much.]
Mr I S MFUNDISI: Madam Speaker and colleagues, today marks the last day of the parliamentary year. We shall be going home to be with our families for a while. To most of us here it will be that time of remembering the activity of Christ, and we wish all Christians the best of time, as they celebrate the birth of the Prince of Peace.
This year saw a proliferation of parties in the House, but we are grateful that the exercise did not have any adverse effects on the procedures of this Assembly. We thank the staff for the way in which they were able to adapt to the plethora of parties.
Great thanks go to the service officers who wear smiles all the time as they move about in the Chamber to render services. [Applause.] We could not have made the grade were it not for the dedication of the committee clerks. We owe it to them. We have had an unfortunate year in that this institution has been placed under the microscope on the issue of travel facilities. Our prayer is for members to be honourable and accept the responsibility of being leaders with responsibility.
Great thanks go to the Chief Whip of the Majority Party and other colleagues in the Whippery for keeping together Parliament’s programmes. The presiding officers, the Speaker, the Deputy Speaker, the Chairperson of Committees and the Deputy Chairperson of Committees deserve the greatest applause for holding the debates in focus. God be with you, till we meet again. [Applause.]
Dr M S MOGOBA: Madam Speaker, when I came to this august House, six years ago, I felt like a stranger after my career in education, church and prison, spanning nearly half a century, 43 years to be exact. What struck me most when I first came here was the lack of warmth in this House, even total hostility from the vast majority of people in this House and the fear that prevailed even among people I knew and had worked with before.
The short speaking time given to the minority parties was my next shock. I had to get used to that. With time, I learnt how to make one or two points in a speech, and cut out all the words, even waffle. My famous chop-chop statement pulled me out of media obscurity into prominence of persecution, even almost crucifixion. [Laughter.] That statement gave me useless publicity which was so hostile that I could not even respond to distortions and misinterpretations. [Laughter.]
I do, however, wish to put the record straight. I’m not a violent person. I do not advocate violence. My entire career and belief is a statement that can be made. I was not even in favour of capital punishment, but the horror of the suffering of law-abiding, innocent and defenceless citizens moved me from my original position. Thus, unfortunately, I now proclaim a Galilean recantation, and yet it turns. So, somehow, one gets used to everything, even praying.
I shall miss this Parliament and all the friends I made here. And I just want to thank Madam Speaker, the Deputy Speaker, the officials of this House and all the offices of Parliament for the manner in which they run possibly one of the most important parliaments in the world. I return to the pulpit to serve my home church, in Sekhukhuneland circuit, and I hope that from that situation, I will have the opportunity to pray for the President and for Parliament all the time.
Let me wish you a happy Christmas. Let me wish you accident-free vacations, and I hope God preserves you and preserves this Parliament. Amen. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr J P I BLANCHÉ: Speaker, die FA kyk dankbaar terug oor die politieke verwikkelinge van die afgelope jaar. Dit was ons doelwit om opposisie partye tot die besef te bring dat, ter wille van die land en al sy mense, hulle ‘n alliansie moet vorm en veelpartydemokrasie moet bevorder. [Speaker, the FA is looking back gratefully to the political developments of the past year. It was our objective to bring political parties to the realisation that, for the sake of the country and all its people, they should form an alliance and promote multiparty democracy.]
At the end of another year it is clear that many politicians still do not know what multiparty democracy means. Many thought to themselves they must become a “raasbalie” [windbag] - a one-person party. Others thought they must add “plus” at the end of the name of their party to become multi. [Laughter.]
There was one party whose member thought he must leave his party - and it was a one-man party - and he left it like he leaves a congregation, and now he holds the record for starting one-man parties. Strangest of all, a dying party claims that by joining the ruling party they are strengthening democracy.
The FA, nevertheless, wishes all of you the best over the festive season and holiday period, and hopes that you will experience peace and goodwill, which Christmas brings to the world.
We look forward to seeing you back here in your benches early in the new year, because at the end of the year some of you will no longer be members of this Parliament, and then you will hear many DA speeches. But don’t despair; enjoy the holiday and come back refreshed so that you can perform at your best during your notice month. [Laughter.]
Best wishes to you, Speaker, and your staff, and to all the members in this Chamber. And to everybody who will vote DA next year, I say, “Drive carefully,” and to those who won’t vote for the DA, who am I to tell you how to drive anyway. You never did what the FA told you in any case. Thank you, Madam Speaker. [Laughter.] [Applause.]
Miss S RAJBALLY: Thank you, Madam Speaker. Another year draws to a close and I’m proud - we all have in our diverse political views ensured that democracy stands tall as a beacon of strength of the South African people. We are sworn to perform our duties and have done so joyously.
I would like to take this opportunity to thank all those who have worked long hours to make our duties lighter. May God bless you for your hard work and dedication to the South African way. To the hon members, it has been a challenging year and work well done. I hope that the constituency period will enable us to return next year with greater challenges and better delivery for our people.
To our hon Speaker, Deputy Speaker, hon Ministers, Chief Whip, Deputy Chief Whip, all the Whips, presiding officers, chairpersons of committees and committee clerks, I sincerely thank you for all the time spent in making our system more efficient and effective. To our support staff and those in our offices, I thank you for all your assistance that has made delivery possible. To all those who have played a part in this governmental process, I thank you for your contributions. May God bless you.
Spend the holiday safely and return safely to a fresh year with new challenges. The MF joins in the celebration of our 10 years of democracy, and as the MF we also celebrate 10 years of existence in 2004. Merry Christmas and a happy New Year filled with love, festivity and joy to all. May I just say: Please don’t drink and drive; if you drink, don’t drive, if you drive, don’t drink. God bless all of you. Thank you. [Applause.]
Mr C AUCAMP: Madam Speaker, I believe this is my last end-of-the-year farewell speech in this House, because after the elections the NA will be big enough to have its own Whip to perform this function. [Laughter.]
On behalf of the NA, I want to thank everyone for their contributions during the past year: to you, Madam Speaker, your Deputy and co-chairs, the personnel, the Whips, our secretaries, and the media. It was a difficult year of adapting after the floor-crossings, and at the end of the day we all came through it alive.
In view of the failure of our Springbok team at the Rugby World Cup, I thought it fit today to choose a team from the ranks of Parliament, which would definitely have done better. And it is my privilege to announce that team today. Unfortunately, some of the members are not present.
As fullback we choose the hon Tony Leon because of his ability to fight back from behind. [Laughter.] And, then, after his marriage to the CP, the hon Petrus Mulder will, of course, occupy the right wing, with the hon Jeremy Cronin on the left. [Laughter.]
The inside centre position will be taken by the hon Mosiuoa Lekota. He has proved this year that he can take a lot of tackles. [Laughter.] The other centre will be the Rev Kenneth Meshoe; we must have someone on the team with higher contacts as well. [Laughter.]
As fly half, of course the hon Minister of Health. She tends to drop everything that comes her way. [Laughter.] As scrum half, the Minister of Justice - he knows how to kick for touch when in trouble. [Laughter.]
Our tight-head prop is, of course, the Minister of Sport. By the way, he’s the only quota player in the team; the rest were chosen on merit. [Laughter.] As for our loose-head prop, well, Patricia “het haar kop verloor” [lost her head], but the hon Willem Odendaal gets the nod. [Laughter.] Our hooker is the hon Dennis Bloem. Ons moet darem een moeilikheidmaker in die span hê. [We should have at least one troublemaker in the team.] [Laughter.]
Die een slot is Dr Boy Geldenhuys, want as die ANC sê spring dan spring hy. [The one lock is Dr Boy Geldenhuys, because when the ANC says jump, he asks how high.] [Laughter.] The other one must be the hon Gerhard Koornhof, but he has a tendency to cross over to the opposition side halfway through the match. [Laughter.]
The one flank will be the hon Deputy President. He has proved over and over again that he will never get a yellow card. [Laughter.] The number eight will be the hon Douglas Gibson, only because of his nuisance value. [Laughter.]
The team will be captained by President Mbeki, provided it plays overseas, otherwise availability may be a problem. [Laughter.] The imbongi, with skildvel [hide shield] and assegai will be the hon Buthelezi.
The referee, of course, is Adriaan Blaas-die-fluitjie [blow the whistle], and the media officer will be Carol Johnson - if she can sell the New NP to 100 people, she will also be able to sell this team to 40 million people. [Laughter.]
Madam Speaker, you will be the coach, but please, no Kamp Staaldraad, we suffer enough in Parliament. [Laughter.]
To all the members, everything of the best, a peaceful and enriching festive season, and may we see you all here again next year. Thank you. [Applause.]
Ms T E MILLIN: That is really unfair to have to follow such an act. Well done, Cassie.
Hon Speaker, hon colleagues on all sides of this House, on behalf of the IAM, I would like to extend my heartfelt best wishes to all my parliamentary colleagues, and particularly to the various Whips, as well as to all the parliamentary support staff, all the officials and everyone who has been so helpful and who has really done so much to ease me into the workings of the National Assembly earlier this year.
I pray that all of you enjoy a healthy, happy and peaceful recess with your families and loved ones, and that we may all safely return next year - probably only for a very short time - refreshed and ready for whatever 2004 may hold for us. I thank you, Madam Speaker. [Applause.]
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Madam Speaker, may I please seize this opportunity with both hands to thank the presiding officers for the indelible marks made forever on our minds, and for your guidance on the proceedings of this House. We thank you for your guidance on the proceedings of this House. We thank the Presidency for the immense contributions it makes, adding to the vibrancy of debate on this public platform.
We also thank Ministers, Deputy Ministers, as well as the chairs of committees and Whips of all parties for their preoccupation with the nuts and bolts that keep the engine running. It has been a marathon year in the service of our country and people. We thank all the members of this House for hanging in there. To the Table staff, Legislation and Proceedings, service officers, catering and security services, Mamabolo, Kallie Pauw, Goskar, Jenny, Hugo, Sis Joyce, Coert Smit, Charlotte Rademeyer in Questions - we take our hats off to all of you.
To all the support staff of all parties, to each and every soul whose life is spent feeding on this, holding on to the noble aspirations of our people; to all we say: Let us continue serving our beautiful country and our people. We thank you.
To members of the media, in particular the Press Gallery Association - your role is invaluable. We do not have the words, you do: Thank you. May you all, your families and friends have an enjoyable holiday season. Thank you, Madam Speaker. [Applause.]
The SPEAKER: Hon members, we have a few months left of the first decade of our democracy. We may want to take that time to reflect, not just on the past, but on the lessons of the past, so we can hand them on to the new Parliament, where we have to look at whether we are there or not. It is our duty to hand on our experience so that it can then be built on and the new group can build upon what we leave.
In the first five years of our democracy we created a constitution which others might have said was undemocratic, because we said we would not allow elections for five years. I do not think we remember that and the reason was that we said that whatever the results, we all had to live with them for five years and learn to work together during those five years. I think we have learnt to live with each other. I think we have learnt to live with each other and co-operate, though we all like to believe we don’t, except during the end of year farewell speeches.
Otherwise, we have worked well. We have created good laws. With many we had to amend more than we should have; but I think we have learnt on the way. Therefore, I think we need to be aware of just how much we have achieved. The coverage we get is not always good, but we should not buy into that. Generally this has been a very hardworking Parliament and one that has achieved much. One just has to look across and visit other parliaments and see the regard they have for this Parliament and its members.
Whatever people say, members are not layabouts. Members have worked very, very hard. [Applause.] They have worked hard, often in difficult circumstances. I am sure Sybil Seaton will appreciate it when I say, with not sufficient resources, and I am sure all of you will say that. We also need in the future to see how we use whatever resources we can acquire better, manage them better. We have achieved much and I would like to thank you all for the effort that has gone into that achievement.
I have spent a lot of time trying to figure out whether members keep the Whips in order, or the Whips keep the members in order. I am afraid I have not quite resolved that. I will continue to try and resolve that, but whichever way it went, thank you, members and Whips for keeping order. Someone referred to the problems of Taiwan, Korea and more recently, to the national problems in Georgia regarding parliament.
I speculated as I was watching it on television where there was an invasion of their parliament, and speakers and the president of the country had to be taken out. South Africa’s democracy is not like that. We have had two elections, we have changed and accepted the results. I believe we will go into the new election and accept the results and live with them, whatever they are.
We have managed what we have also because of the support of the staff. First and foremost, I want to thank the staff of the National Assembly, the Table staff under the Secretary of the National Assembly, Mr Hahndiek, the service officers, the sound system operators - because technically we needed much support, which I hope will be remedied by the time we come back
- the interpreters, the language services, the many, many people who sometimes are not visible on the floor but who actually enable the Assembly to function.
I would like to thank the Secretary, Deputy and Assistant Secretaries to Parliament and all the different divisions who have provided services to facilitate our work - sometimes we say to frustrate our work - but on balance it has been to facilitate and make it easier. I do not want to omit thanking the catering services, because whatever our comments are about a particular meal, they have provided sustenance regularly and on time. The cleaners and security staff may have thumped the cars, but basically we have been protected. In troubled times that is something we need to be very grateful for. It has been a kind of security that a parliament needs and that is not obvious. We are not overwhelmed by security, and yet I think every one of us has been able to feel secure as we have carried out our work.
To the members of the press: I would like to thank them for coverage. In extent, it has improved. If I had a wish for them, I think I would wish them a little more discerning eyes in the new year so that they see much more, and more space from their editors so they can give more space and coverage to what happens in Parliament. I would like to thank the Parliamentary Office-Bearers, the Chair and Deputy Chair of Committees, the chairs of committees, the Parliamentary Liaison Offices and most importantly, the Deputy Speaker, who has always been there, supportive in the overall management of this institution.
To all of you, I wish you a well-earned rest, followed by enjoyable festivities, invigorating electioneering - as if I needed to remind you all of that - and to suggest that you are stimulated when you return in January as we go into our next decade. I want to wish you the fulfilment of all your wishes, but that wish rather fills me with trepidation. I had to cope this last year, as we have shifted from 13 to 18 parties, and the trepidation comes - and if all your wishes are granted - I will have seven or eight majority parties to cope with. And I don’t know how any presiding officer would ever be able to manage that process.
Maybe the advice given by Mr Aucamp about the coaching methods and team- building spirit may be something that will be needed with that many parties. Whatever it is, I hope the laughter he engendered in this House will stimulate you throughout the rest of this year and into the new year. We will see you all in January: refreshed, invigorated, champing at the bit to finish the last few months of this first decade of South Africa’s democratic Parliament. Go well, come back safely and come back reinvigorated. Thank you. [Applause.]
The House adjourned at 17:33. ____
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- Bills passed by Houses - to be submitted to President for assent:
(1) Bills passed by National Assembly on 27 November 2003:
(i) National Environmental Management: Protected Areas Bill [B
39D - 2003] (National Assembly - sec 76)
(ii) Environment Conservation Amendment Bill [B 45D - 2003]
(National Assembly - sec 76)
(iii) Restitution of Land Rights Amendment Bill [B 42D - 2003]
(National Assembly - sec 75)
(2) Bills passed by National Council of Provinces on 27 November
2003:
(i) Adjustments Appropriation Bill [B 69 - 2003] (National
Assembly - sec 77)
(ii) Revenue Laws Amendment Bill [B 71 - 2003] (National
Assembly - sec 77)
(iii) Liquor Bill [B 23F - 2003] (National Assembly - sec 76)
(iv) Electoral Laws Second Amendment Bill [B 73 - 2003]
(National Assembly - sec 75)
(v) Judicial Matters Second Amendment Bill [B 41B - 2003]
(National Assembly - sec 75)
National Assembly:
- Referrals to committees of papers tabled:
The following papers have been tabled and are now referred to the
relevant committees as mentioned below:
(1) The following paper is referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Finance:
Government Notice No R1454 published in Government Gazette No
25557 dated 8 October 2003: Regulations: Procedures for submitting
returns in electronic format and requirements for electronic
signatures in terms of the Income Tax Act, 1962 (Act No 58 of
1962).
(2) The following papers are referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Trade and Industry. The Reports of the Independent Auditors on the
Financial Statements are referred to the Standing Committee on
Public Accounts for consideration and report:
(a) Report and Financial Statements of Proudly South African
for 2002-2003, including the Report of the Independent
Auditors on the Financial Statements for 2002-2003.
(b) Report and Financial Statements of the Industrial
Development Corporation of South Africa Limited for the year
ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent
Auditors on the Financial Statements for the year ended June
2003.
(3) The following papers are referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Justice and Constitutional Development:
(a) Government Notice No R1593 published in Government Gazette
No 25637 dated 31 October 2003: Regulations: Judicial Officers
in Lower Courts, 1994: Amendment in terms of the Magistrates
Act, 1993 (Act No 90 of 1993).
(b) Government Notice No R1660 published in Government Gazette
No 25695 dated 12 November 2003: Regulations regarding
reparations to victims in terms of the Promotion of National
Unity and Reconciliation Act, 1995 (Act No 34 of 1995).
(c) Government Notice No R1623 published in Government Gazette
No 25666 dated 7 November 2003: Amendment of regulations in
terms of the Debt Collectors Act, 1998 (Act No 114 of 1998).
(4) The following papers are referred to the Standing Committee on
Public Accounts for consideration:
(a) Special Report of the Auditor-General on the Delays in the
Tabling of Annual Reports for 2002-2003, as required by the
Public Finance Management Act, 1999 (Act No 1 of 1999) [RP 215-
2003].
(b) Letter dated 18 November 2003, from the Minister of
Education to the Speaker of the National Assembly, in terms of
section 65(2)(a) of the Public Finance Management Act, 1999
(Act No 1 of 1999), explaining the delay in the tabling of the
Annual Reports of the South African Council for Educators
(SACE) and the Council on Higher Educators (CHE) for 2002-
2003.
(5) The following paper is referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Provincial and Local Government:
Report and Financial Statements of the Board for Municipal
Accountants for 2002-2003.
(6) The following paper is referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Foreign Affairs for information:
Report of the National Assembly Delegation to the 34th
Commonwealth Parliamentary Association (CPA) Africa Region
Conference held in Nairobi, Kenya from 2-9 August 2003.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Minister of Finance:
Report and Financial Statements of the Public Investment Commissioners
for 2002-2003, including the Report of the Auditor-General on the
Financial Statements for 2002-2003 [RP 152-2003].
- The Minister of Public Works:
(a) Community Based Public Works Programme for 2000-2001.
(b) Community Based Public Works Programme for 2001-2002.
(c) Community Based Public Works Programme for 2002-2003.
(d) Community Based Public Works Programme for 2003-2004.
- The Minister of Water Affairs and Forestry:
(a) Report and Financial Statements of Amatola Water for the year
ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors
for the year ended June 2003.
(b) Report and Financial Statements of Botshelo Water for the year
ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors
for the year ended June 2003.
(c) Report and Financial Statements of Lepelle Northern Water for
the year ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent
Auditors for the year ended June 2003.
(d) Report and Financial Statements of Namaqua Water for the year
ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors
for the year ended June 2003.
(e) Report and Financial Statements of Overberg Water for the year
ended June 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors
for the year ended June 2003.
(f) Report and Financial Statements of Rand Water for the year ended
June 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors for
the year ended June 2003.
- The Minister of Housing:
(a) Report and Financial Statements of the Rural Housing Loan Fund
(RHLF) for 2002-2003, including the Report of the Independent
Auditors on the Financial Statements for 2002-2003.
(b) Report and Financial Statements of the Social Housing Foundation
(SHF) for 2002-2003, including the Report of the Independent
Auditors on the Financial Statements for 2002-2003.
(c) Report and Financial Statements of Thubelisha Homes for 2002-
2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors on the
Financial Statements for 2002-2003.
(d) Report and Financial Statements of Servcon Housing Solutions
(Proprietary) Limited for 2002-2003, including the Report of the
Independent Auditors on the Financial Statements for 2002-2003.
(e) Report and Financial Statements of the National Urban
Reconstruction and Housing Agency for 2002-2003, including the
Report of the Independent Auditors on the Financial Statements for
2002-2003.
(f) Report and Financial Statements of National Housing Finance
Corporation Limited for 2002-2003, including the Report of the
Independent Auditors on the Financial Statements for 2002-2003.