Mr Chairman, on behalf of the Official Opposition in the House of Assembly I am pleased to take part in this debate. First of all I should like to avail myself of the opportunity to thank the Postmaster General, Mr De Villiers, the Deputy Postmasters General and the staff of the Post Office for their commendable work, their enthusiasm and their dedication during the past year. I should also like to address a word of congratulation to the Postmaster General, Mr De Villiers, at the end of his first year of service in his post. I want to express the confidence that he will continue to serve the Post Office and South Africa as Postmaster General for a very long time to come.

Appreciation is also to be expressed for the annual report which has been made available by the Postmaster General.

I naturally also wish to take this opportunity to thank the two Deputy Postmasters General, Mr Johan van Rensburg and Mr Robbie Raath, who are retiring at the end of this month, for the valued service they have rendered to the department over an exceptionally long period. Mr Raath has 49 years of service to the department behind him, and Mr Van Rensburg 45 years—a total of 94 years’ service, which is indeed an exceptional achievement. We thank them for this and we wish them a long and happy retirement.

Further proof of the hard work and enthusiasm which Messrs Van Rensburg and Raath have devoted to the department, emerges clearly from the fact that when they decided to retire after 94 years, no fewer than three Deputy Postmasters General had to be appointed in their place. For this reason it is also a great pleasure for me to congratulate Messrs Jordaan, Oosthuizen and Van Rooyen on their appointments as Deputy Postmasters General. The Official Opposition in the House of Assembly wishes them everything of the best in the great task which rests on their shoulders.

As far as the Budget is concerned, the CP is naturally disappointed to hear about the announced tariff increases. The announced tariff increases are the umpteenth price shock to hit the South African consumer during the past few weeks. First there was the increase in the fuel price, followed by increased transport tariffs and now there is the increase in certain tariffs by Posts and Telecommunications. All these price and tariff increases will indeed have a detrimental effect on the inflation rate. To name but one aspect: The rental for automatic and manual exchanges has been increased by 20%, and this increase affects particularly the less affluent telephone subscribers, for example the aged, pensioners and so on.

When on looks at the position of the aged, one finds that it is the policy at present that the aged should be retained in the community as independently and for as long as possible. In order to realise this policy, an attempt must be made to arrange the aged person’s circumstances and environment comfortably in order by so doing to enable him to maintain his independence.

A very important aspect to those aged persons who live independently, some of them on remote farms, is contact with other people. One of the simplest means of contact is by way of the telephone.

Firstly, contact is a safeguard against loneliness, which can quite possibly, although it sometimes goes unnoticed, affect the aged. A lonely and isolated lifestyle gives rise to tension, anxiety and worry, which can result in physical and psychological illnesses.

Secondly, a telephone keeps the aged person in touch with those members of the community and family members with whom he cannot have regular contact. Communication with his family can give meaning to an aged person’s life and it is a means of reassuring the family with regard to the safety of the older person.

Thirdly, the telephone offers a definite measure of security, but in particular it makes the aged person feel safe because he knows that he can reach help in times of danger. A decisive way of retaining the aged person in the community is to heighten his safety within the community. Measures aimed at retaining the aged person in the community definitely have their economic advantages. Aged persons must therefore be prevented from being admitted to institutions too early.

Therefore, for the reasons I have mentioned, attention needs to be devoted to this matter and that is why we strongly disapprove of these increased tariffs. I should like to bring this matter to the attention of the hon the Minister. Together with the aged, we are grateful that the hon the Minister has already made a concession with regard to the reduced installation costs of telephones for social pensioners. I want to make a further request to the hon the Minister today to consider extending this concession to other pensioners as well as social pensioners. Finally, he must extend the concession in order to make provision for rentals for social pensioners, because they cannot afford the rentals and hence my plea.

The phasing in of the metering of local calls as from 1 April this year will adversely affect the pensioner, and that is precisely why it is vitally important that a concession be granted with regard to rentals.

With reference to this I want to refer to Dr De Villiers’s report and to the possibility of the privatisation of the telecommunications division, for example. Dr De Villiers says in his report that 48% of the subscribers fall into that group whose monthly rental amounts to 56,6% of the monthly account and that this portion is basically uneconomical for the department. We must remember that the aged fall into this very group. The question now is whether the new company will be interested in this small user if the telecommunications division is privatised. As Dr De Villiers says, these are not profitable services, and the company is geared towards profit-seeking. The question is therefore whether privatisation in this instance will not be to the disadvantage of the aged, among others. After all, there is a reason why the pensioner, for example, is a small user.

The reason is one of finance. What is the hon the Minister going to do to prevent such a situation? Dr De Villiers also mentioned that certain tariffs would have to rise. How is the hon the Minister going to address these aspects?

Another aspect which is important in this regard, is the question of farm lines. Dr De Villiers recommends that the automation of farm lines should be held in abeyance until the new party line system has been developed. I should like to know whether the hon the Minister agrees with this. The farm lines are also part of the so-called uneconomic division of telecommunications. The question now arises as to whether the company, in the event of privatisation, will be compelled by way of legislation to render these so-called uneconomic services. These are a few aspects to which I should like to hear the hon the Minister’s response.

As far as the rest of the Budget is concerned, the CP has taken note with thanks of the fact that the department expects an increase of R462,2 million this year, which is 9,9% above the appropriation of R4 677,4 million. The CP takes note of this with gratitude, and it is for precisely this reason that we find it a pity that Dr Wim de Villiers has not also given credit in his report to the department and its officials who have accomplished this.

We are disappointed that Dr De Villiers has dealt out some brickbats and some criticism with regard to the way in which certain matters were dealt with by the department. We should like to hear the hon the Minister’s reaction to this, because the hon the Minister touched very lightly on these matters in the course of his Budget Speech.

As an example, I wish to mention that Dr De Villiers says, inter alia, that the sharp increase in capital expenditure had created the fundamental problem with regard to the financing of the department. He described this as inexplicable. I should like to know from the hon the Minister whether he will explain this matter to us.

Dr De Villiers also said that an imbalance had been created since 1 April 1983. Could the hon the Minister please outline the reason for this imbalance to us? I should also like to know whether the hon the Minister agrees with the following statement by Dr De Villiers. He said that it would appear as if an amount of the order of R1 900 million in excess capacity which was not being utilized at present, had been invested in the communications network from 1984 to 1988. Dr De Villiers said that foreign debt had increased by R1 058,1 million during this period. Foreign loans amounted to R1 603,8 million on 31 March 1988, whilst the currency loss on this was R 1 646 million on 30 June 1988. The total debts therefore amounted to R3 249,8 million.

Does the hon the Minister agree with these statements by Dr De Villiers? Dr De Villiers goes on to say that the implication is clear. A large portion, and possibly the total current loan amount of R3 249,8 million of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications could have been avoided if so much excess capacity had not been provided. We should like to know from the hon the Minister whether he agrees with these statements. If not, he must say so. If so, what is he going to do about it?

Dr De Villiers also said that at present 3,7 telephones out of every 10—in other words 37%—could not be accounted for. Is this true? We look forward to the hon the Minister’s reply and full details in this regard.

Dr De Villiers has dealt out brickbats and criticism left and right against the hon the Minister’s department. That is why I am asking the hon the Minister to respond to them. Dr De Villiers says, inter alia, the following on page 41 of his report:

Does the hon the Minister agree with this? If not, he must please say so. If Dr De Villiers’s statements are correct, the hon the Minister will have to account for them here, because in that case the tariff increases which will increase Post Office income by R221,8 million and result in a surplus of R195,4 million, are totally inappropriate and unjustified, because it cannot be expected of the Post Office and Telecommunications consumer to pay for the inexplicable sharp increase in capital expenditure which is the cause of the fundamental problem with regard to the financing of the department, according to Dr De Villiers.

Another aspect I should like to touch on, is an aspect which the hon the Minister raised last year in reply to a question by, inter alia, the hon member for Groote Schuur with regard to Posmed. On that occasion the hon the Minister said the following, and I quote from Hansard, 14 March 1988, col 3706:

The hon the Minister went on to say the following last year:

The hon the Minister then went further and said that Posmed had 49 000 members and that it was only a White medical scheme. Yes, the hon the Minister said that Posmed was autonomous, but he nevertheless went ahead and, at the cost of the department, sent voting papers to Posmed’s 49 000 members with the request that they vote whether or not they were in favour of the opening up of Posmed. The hon the Minister is therefore interfering in one of the affairs of Posmed, which is an autonomous body, and he is doing so at the cost of the Post Office. The hon the Minister’s department is regulating the matter, as appears from the letter on the department’s letterhead and from a report in the Pretoria News of 23 February, in which the following is said:

The question, therefore, is whether the hon the Minister issued this instruction. If so, why is he interfering in the functioning of an autonomous body like Posmed? What was the object of the entire exercise?

I have a further question. What did this futile exercise cost the Post Office? What was the result of the voting? I therefore ask why he is interfering. This is a matter that does not concern him. In fact, this is a matter on which the board of Posmed could simply have taken its own decision.

During the Post Office debate last year the hon the Minister said he could not understand why the hon member for Groote Schuur had spoken about the matter, because after all he had been aware of the situation. It is for this very reason that it is inexplicable why the hon the Minister and his department had to interfere in the affairs of Posmed.

The CP is therefore not prepared to support the Post Office Appropriation Bill, and consequently we shall vote against it.

Mr Chairman, I want to associate myself with the previous hon member’s congratulations to the Postmaster General and his top echelons of management. On behalf of the House, I also want to wish the gentlemen who are retiring a long and pleasant retirement and the new deputies a rosy future.

I should like to say a few words to the previous speaker’s party, simply because they always stand with their backs to us, but their backs are not protected at all. Is it not strange that the CP wants to take the country back to the political “Nommer Asseblief ’ days in an era of astonishing technological progress as regards telecommunications? It can surely not work! Boksburg, Brakpan and Carletonville are examples of successful failures, thanks to the CP’s “Nommer Asseblief’ policy. [Interjections ] The frustration which the CP has caused with its retrogressive step is even common knowledge far beyond our country’s borders.

If one looks at the Post Office appropriations of the past two years, one cannot do otherwise but compare it with the successful dieting programme of an attractive woman. In the Post Office appropriations of the past two years the hon the Minister has succeeded in getting rid of a lot of the excess fat in the form of capital and operating expenditure. It is becoming increasingly pleasant to look at the slim outline of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications’ appropriation. The public should have great appreciation for this. After all, in the long run it was the public that had to pay for this extra fat in the past.

The fat which the department’s appropriations have lost, means more money in the public’s purse. The exceptional achievements and the increasing success of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications are embodied in a few praiseworthy steps. It is clear that the improved financial position of the post office may be ascribed to strict measures to save on costs, as well as the application of financial discipline.

The story of the slim outline of the Post Office actually started with last year’s appropriation. In the 1986-87 financial year the Post Office converted an estimated operating deficit into an operating surplus of R112 million. In the 1985-86 financial year the Post Office had an operating loss of R107,6 million. In the 1986-87 financial year a surplus of R496 million was achieved which cancelled out the loss of the previous year. This is no mean achievement. The remaining R362,3 million was used to repay loans, to increase capital, to enlarge the loan scheme for accommodation and for capital expenditure.

One hopes that the hon the Minister will not be in too much of a hurry to go further with privatisation and deregulation. Last year he already intimated that the private sector was only going to be allowed to provide and maintain certain services of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications—this is gratifying. Thorough investigations are needed before the organisation is fully privatised.

I do want to ask what is being done to accommodate the aged as regards inevitable cost increases. For many of them the telephone is a necessity. An elderly person once put it as follows: “When one lifts the receiver and dials the number, one is automatically debited by an amount. The so-called cheap time does not seem to mean cheaper tariffs, but merely longer conversations for the same price”.

However, the aged do not need long conversations, so much as more frequent shorter conversations. Few people realise the pleasure and happiness which such a call brings into the otherwise humdrum existence of an elderly father or mother. Can the aged not be accommodated in this respect? From a technological point of view this idea may be impractical. Perhaps technology will develop in such a way that something special can be done for the aged. We must bear in mind that we will always have the aged with us. Their need continues, particularly when cost increases take place more rapidly.

The dynamism of technology is common knowledge. It is good to know that South Africa need not take a back seat. The renewal and modernisation of the Post Office is also continuing. It is common knowledge that by the year 2000 all telephone exchanges in the country will be electronic. More than 35% of all our telephone exchanges are already electronic.

The LP has taken cognisance of the fact that there were no tariff adjustments on local tariffs in the 1987-88 financial year, and expresses its thanks to the hon the Minister who succeeded in pegging down tariffs.

I also welcome the fact that there is no increase in telephone call tariffs nor in concessionary tariffs for social pensioners. However, the LP deplores the increase in the tariffs for the installation of telephones, in the rental for central connections and in telegram tariffs, and particularly the increase in the price of stamps, an increase which is going to affect the man in the street in particular.

I should also like to talk about the matter of productivity because I see the enormous amount of R6.422 million is being voted for the needs of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications. I assume that the money is going to be used in a profitable way, and that the services rendered to the general public will be improved. However, when I talk about profitable expenditure, I mean that this will include productivity.

When we talk about productivity, there are three components which must be considered. There is definitely a great deal of room for improvement in this sphere. It is the wish of the LP that an adequate amount of the money voted will be spent on training courses for Post Office staff, so that they can develop the right attitude and can display ordinary politeness in their duties towards the public.

The department says that it has as its objective to orientate and develop all its employees, from new entrants right up to senior managerial level, to such an extent that they will be adequately equipped to keep pace with the high demands and challenges of a modern and business-orientated organisation like the Post Office.

Particularly now that the De Villiers Report’s recommendations have been accepted, as well as in the light of the fact that this organisation is moving towards privatisation and deregulation, this is even more applicable. These are fine words and feelings. However, the equiping of employees to deal with such demand does not only involve the technological and scientific aspects. The factor of proper human relations—how to treat the public like people who are entitled to be treated in a dignified manner—is the most important attitude which must be developed in every person. The Post Office must concentrate on the need to train its employees to adopt the correct attitude. This must be of the utmost importance.

Firstly this means providing a service which satisfies clients. Here one is particularly referring to the very poor postal services provided by so many people behind the counters of our post offices and telephone exchanges, particularly in the smaller rural areas.

A second example of productivity is the matter of the closing of post offices during the lunch hour, when it is convenient for so many residents to undertake their postal transactions. A minimum staff system can definitely overcome this real inconvenience. I also want to mention the crowding in certain post offices, which causes long delays, particularly when pensions are paid out, or when counters are closed during peak periods. Because of these delays I can say with some conviction that the Post Office is losing many prospective clients, who want to open savings accounts, at the counters.

Thirdly, productivity involves the right attitude towards the public. The difference between the adequately trained public servant and the inadequately trained public servant is his attitude towards the public. Posts and telecommunications’ operators frequently fall far short in their daily activities as regards the right attitude. A curt tone of voice or a cutting remark to slow clients, or an impatient handing of stamps or money to clients across the counter are things which one regularly comes across in post offices in many parts of our country.

There is also the aspect contained in the Biblical injunction that the labourer is worthy of his hire. The Department of Posts and Telecommunications has thousands of people in its employ, who all receive salary increases for services rendered. It is hoped that the rendering of services by the employees will increase in accordance with their salary increases. We see how the postal services render services in so many work sectors every day, and we see the amount of time that is wasted. We also see how individuals take their time with certain tasks. These displays give a bad name to the good work which is being done by many efficient operators.

We are making a strong appeal for productivity, in other words the producing of results will in the shortest possible time become the motto in the training given to employees in the postal services. I am aware of the posters at the post offices with slogans such as: “Werk fluks en flink en maak jou toekoms blink”, or “Look after your productivity and the Post Office will look after you”. The point I want to make is that this is simply not good enough.

With reference to the last-mentioned I do want to say that I am well aware of the straitened conditions caused by inflation and circumstances beyond the control of the people on behalf of whom I have been asked to talk today. I therefore have the sad duty of relating the suffering of people, particularly pensioners, who are nearing the end of their lives. These are people who in their youth served the country with indisputable loyalty, including men who built the country and others who returned from the battlefield where they defended the country. Today they are dependent on the State. Let us give them service and their pensions in a respectable way, recognising their human dignity. In this regard I want to make an appeal that on pension days matters will be handled with far more circumspection.

Mr Chairman, I cannot agree with the hon member who has just taken his seat with regard to many of the problems which he has with a post office, because in Boksburg we no longer have that type of problem. Not many people visit the Post Office any more. [Interjections.] The town is going into a decline, but you can be sure that there is still a lot of power in that town. That town will yet bring the CP to book precisely on account of the deterioration which has been caused there.

On behalf of the NP, I want to express our thanks and appreciation to the management team of the Post Office for all the well-compiled reports and the work which they have done during the past year. I also want to convey our thanks and appreciation to Mr Johan van Rensburg and Mr Robbie Raath. We have come to know them over many years in this Parliament and have worked with them in the head office of the Post Office. We are also sorry to be saying goodbye to them. We want to wish them a very pleasant retirement period on the road ahead.

The hon member for Venterspos said that the elderly were not being taken care of. We cannot agree with that, because this report indicates that for the umpteenth time there has been no change or increase in the installation costs of telephones. There are also cheaper tariffs during certain times, when the telephone can be used by those people. In our experience, both the hon the Minister and his management team have always attended to pensioners with compassion. It was also noticeable that the hon member did not understand what appeared in the report of Dr Wim de Villiers, because if he had paid attention in the joint committee, he would have realised that many of the things which appeared in the report, were succinctly explained there. That hon member now wants the hon the Minister to explain matters to him all over again. [Interjections.] It is very clear that the hon member does not understand what is being conveyed to him in such reports. Either he does not want to understand it, or he does not want to accept that certain adjustments must be made. The reason why Parliament requested this report, was so that we would be able to see what the state of affairs in the Post Office was. If the hon member had read the documents that were handed to him yesterday he would have known that it was largely as a result of the loan debt that the Post Office has these problems. However, I am going to leave the matter there for the moment, and I shall return to the CP later.

It was somewhat disappointing for us to have to take note in this Appropriation of the Post Office’s intention to cut back on the capital investment programme, but seen in the light of Dr De Villiers’s warning that capital expenditure should be affordable and able to be financed, this step is acceptable to those of us on this side of the House.

After the recent announcement by Sanlam that it has R2 billion available for investment in the economy of South Africa, we want to express the hope that the Post Office will be considered as a field of investment by them. I think it is one of the best investment fields that can be looked at. The CP do not like to see them as a helping hand; possibly they would rather see them as a moneyed interest. Those of us on this side of the House know that they are one of the two great helping hands in the country.

Those of us who represent constituencies that are being affected by this cutback in the Appropriation, cannot but be concerned in our heart of hearts about the fact that this will have to coincide with the dismissal of workers at certain factories. We hope that speedy solutions to that problem will be found by the managements of the factories concerned. Those of us on this side will work with them and we know that the Post Office will do the same to see whether we can help them so that this may take place as soon as possible.

South Africa must also guard against being saddled with out-dated communications systems at the turn of the century. It is a recognised fact that Europe plans to be fully served by digital networks by the turn of the century. We accept that Europe is more advanced and can afford it, but for that very reason the Post Office must not lower their sights now, because the phenomenal growth in South African trade can be attributed to the fact that we accepted digital networks as a system for South Africa a long time ago. We believe that they must be expanded once the problems with regard to our loan debt have been solved. This digital system has played a large role in our country’s growth to date, and we believe that it will play an even greater role in the future, not only for South Africa but, in fact, for Southern Africa, because if we want to expand this Southern point of the continent, we must view it on a regional basis. The Post Office, in its role as a regional post office, must then also supply a service to the networks in all the surrounding countries.

For example, the report shows that the growth of Telefax is reflected in the decline of the Telex. This is an indication that the outdated systems are on their way out, and the new fax machines are taking over in the sphere of trade and industry. We see this as proof that trade and industry are geared towards the more competitive utilisation of modern equipment. The maintenance costs of digital systems are also far lower, and in the future we will not be able to lose sight of that asset. I want to make an earnest appeal to the Post Office to make regular adjustments in an effort to speed up the process and possibly bring forward the target date which it has set in this report. I believe that when they eventually join the private sector, they should still look at whether the year 2020 is not too far in the future and they should attempt to phase out the older equipment before that year.

South Africa is not a Second or Third World country. The Republic is a small country which has strong ties with the First World. Although the majority of the Republic’s population possibly still have ties with the Third World, those ties are being broken very quickly, precisely as a result of the excellent communications systems and the advanced technology which exists here at the southernmost point of Africa.

In my opinion, the economic growth of our country also lies in the orderly urbanisation of the population. This vitally necessary growth can only take place if the industries and the business sector are able to rely on the most modern equipment and networks. For this reason I want to appeal to the Post Office to continue to see its role as one of planner in South Africa and to make this country a winning country in the field in which it is involved. Technology is important in enabling us to develop and to remain a part of the Western World. Nowadays technology sets the pace of progress.

What amazes me about this debate, is that a few weeks ago, the Official Opposition in the House of Assembly were full of praise for the 15 % salary adjustment which was granted to the Post Office personnel. Now that very party is complaining about the tariff increases. When tariff increases are implemented in the private sector, they accept them. If the farmer pays his people more, they accept that as an excuse for the higher price of the product. Why can they not accept this when the Post Office has to pay its people more money? The Post Office does not sell a product, but a service. If it then has to pay for that service out of loan money or its own money which it receives, and it grants increases of this nature, surely it cannot recover that money in any other way.

The hon member has just referred to the fact that this is inflationary. However, the hon the Minister said in his speech that it would only increase the price index by 0,07%. It is ridiculous to allege that this would have an inflationary effect on the economy. I can well agree with him that other tariff increases in other spheres could perhaps have that effect. However, this one is so small that I believe he should not even have mentioned it.

We on this side of the Committee are waiting for the day when we can remove the Post Office from the political arena, because this is all those hon members are doing with the Post Office. They are playing politics with it. If it were removed from the political arena, those functionaries he has so lauded and praised, could carry on with their work in the private sector as in any normal business.

How does the opposition expect the Postmaster-General to pay for the growing economic services of the country if he is not even allowed to increase the costs relating to his staff? The Post Office does not even pay dividends. It must make money somewhere to provide new services and improve existing ones.

While I am talking about salaries, we want to express our gratitude and appreciation for the fact that the salaries of the technical staff have now been adjusted to a market-related level. We will no longer be training those people unnecessarily and then losing them to the private sector. Well-trained technologists grow hand-in-hand with a modern technology. That is the other reason why I am advocating that we keep abreast of technological progress, because such people become frustrated when they are working with systems that are out of date and they are then more likely to leave one’s employ.

We have heard that there have been protests against the increased telephone rental. It is clear from the hon the Minister’s speech that the costs of the service are still not being recovered by the new rental. There are those who maintain that telephones in private homes should be cheaper than those in the business sector.

Politicians in South Africa must learn to give the lead to the people and not to be led by the people. We must not echo the sentiments of every voter who complains. The posts and telecommunications service does not belong to this House, but to the voters. His children will one day have to pay more if we want to enjoy luxuries today.

Dr Wim de Villiers spelt out very clearly in his report that we should pause for a while and consolidate. We should therefore tell the telephone users that they cannot expect the business sector to subsidise their telephones. If they want a telephone, it is a line they share with their children or anyone else and they should be prepared to pay for it.

These days the trend is for the telephone to be moved out of the business sector and into the private homes. Just think of the doctor, the insurance agent, the Tupperware salesman, the farmer and so many other small businessmen who work from their homes. How can one therefore differentiate between users of telephones?

This brings me to another matter I want to raise about the Post Office’s policy. Everyone in the country criticises the Government about each and every department and about the way in which those departments ought to be run. But those who complain never tell one how they would do it themselves.

I asked the hon the Leader of the Official Opposition in the House of Assembly to be here, but I understand he is unable to be present. However, would the other hon opposition members pass the following on to him. It seems to me that the hon member for Pietersburg is the most senior member, and I would appreciate it if he would listen to the following on behalf of the hon the Leader of the Official Opposition.

How would it be possible to run the Post Office under a CP Government? Under an NP Government, with the policy of reform and powersharing, we must cut down on the capital investment of the system because the rate of growth must keep pace with the development of the country and the development of the respective population groups.

The CP says one should plough White money into a White “volkstaat” and spend on the other groups what they can afford from their revenue accounts. After six months of CP control in Boksburg’s town council there are already big CP businessmen who are starting to throw in the towel. If the businessmen—the job-creators of the community—are being ruined economically by the policy of a political party, the trade and industry of that area and community die off. That community can then no longer afford extended telephone and telecommunications networks, because the infrastructure becomes too expensive for such a community to maintain.

If a community’s trade declines because people of colour are unwelcome in its business sector, the business sector falls into a decline and consequently fewer and fewer people use the telephone. The businessman no longer uses his telephone to place orders and arrange deliveries, because no orders are being placed and no deliveries are being made.

If the plumber’s services are no longer being used, it is pointless for him to rent a telephone and have his number put in the book, because nobody will telephone him; and the CP must realise this. If a building society were to take its computer and equipment out of the building occupied by the mayor of a town like this, that businessman would no longer be connected with the business group he was previously connected with, and that line would no longer serve any purpose. The telephone exchange would then merely have another line that was not being used. The business sector would then become smaller and the communications system would be underutilised, resulting in its becoming more expensive for the people of that area, and eventually more expensive for the country.

If one were the seller of building materials and hardware, and Coloured builders, plumbers, painters and artisans no longer supported one because one denied them a share in the prosperity of one’s town, one should write to Dr Treurnicht. I have a letter addressed to me by a CP member stating that the member was enclosing a letter he had written to Dr Treurnicht. The writer says he is a member of the CP and voted for the town council which was in favour of the CP mandate being implemented. This writer says that that mandate has led to his impoverishment. It has driven him to bankruptcy. In his letter he says that at one stage he could have sold his business for R50 000, and at present he is advertising it for R35 000. My question to the hon the leader of the Official Opposition in the House of Assembly is: With what is he going to prevent his networks from declining even further? With what is he going to help the factories that manufacture telephone communications …

Order!

… equipment?

Order! No, the hon member’s time has not yet expired, but he is digressing. The hon member still has a few seconds.

I want to point out that when this business sector begins to decline, the infrastructure provided by the State, including the Post Office, is in danger. [Interjections.] Then the factories which manufacture telecommunications equipment in that town are in danger! Then the job opportunities of the people who work in those factories are in danger. [Interjections.] This is what it is all about! This is what one should tell the CP. Whether one’s “volkstaat” is in the Namib or in Naboomspruit, one cannot partition the networks of the Post Office and the SATS. One cannot say this is the Whites’ telephone exchange, that is the Coloureds’ exchange and that is the Indians’ exchange. [Interjections.] The question is then: How on earth do they intend to partition this country’s systems which cost billions of rand? [Time expired.]

Mr Chairman, I notice that the Post Office Budget shows that a higher revenue of R462,6 million and an operating surplus of R 538,6 million is expected this year. Since the financial position of the consumer is unfavourable I am surprised that the hon the Minister of Communications has decided to increase the various service tariffs.

The increases in postal tariffs are unfortunate and regrettable. These increases will certainly add to a rise in the inflation rate. Postal tariffs should be made cost-effective and to achieve this the Post Office should promote a greater use of their services. This will result in a great utilisation of capital resources and thereby prevent these increases.

I am bitterly disappointed at the 2c increase in ordinary postage and the increase in the telegram tariff. I am aware of the fact that ordinary postage is being subsidized to the tune of about 10c at the moment. However, the 2c increase in the cost of stamps and the telegraph increases will have a tremendous effect on our Black community whose prime means of communication with their families is by ordinary post. We must also realize that many of them send their their wages to their families at home by telegraph.

This tremendous increase in the telegraph charges is also going to have a detrimental effect on their financial resources. I would like to appeal to the hon the Minister to have another look at this aspect in order to bring about some measure of relief to our Black community.

I now come to productivity. It is a fact that when the productivity of any sector is limited, a terrible price is exacted in terms of unemployment and lost opportunities. The Department of Posts and Telecommunications has to take this aspect of its economic realities into account. To achieve greater productivity all forms of restrictive conditions and discriminatory practices within its framework should be scrapped, bearing in mind the further advancement of the country.

I believe the first move in this direction should be to promote the consolidation of the various staff associations into a single association made up of the various race groups within the department. The existence of four exclusively White and three mixed staff associations cannot be conducive to the process of progress. It is quite clear that the four White staff associations have the upper hand in making decisions with the management.

In a previous debate the hon the Minister said there was no discrimination in the Post Office. If this is so, I would like to ask why non-Whites are not allowed to supervise Whites. The hon the Minister stated further that the Post Office goes out of its way to promote members of all population groups, particularly those groups that are not fully represented. I mentioned in my speech that there was a Grade 1 Indian Postmaster who was employed in a lower grade post office. I wanted to know from the hon the Minister whether this was because he would be supervising Whites if he had to be promoted but I received no reply.

I would like to bring to the attention of the hon the Minister that we presently have a very highly qualified Indian with a B Comm degree who is working in the Durban post office. His job is to supervise the incoming and outgoing post-bags.

There is another Indian employed in Durban who has a B Comm Public Accounting degree. At present he is selling stamps over the counter as a counter assistant. Can the hon the Minister tell us why their talents are not exploited and utilised in the accounting section or at management level?

Unfortunately, there still appears to be segregation within the staff movement. I would like to bring to the hon the Minister’s notice the fact that certain facilities are not available to the other race groups at Liberty House in Durban. I ask him to look into this aspect and to make available all facilities to all race groups.

I would also like to say that I am not unmindful of the fact that there has been some progress in some directions. However, I am particularly concerned about the special study loans that have been introduced this year to staff members for the advancement of their children’s studies. This is widely welcomed, but I would like to ask the hon the Minister whether these bursaries are available to the temporary workers.

There are many temporary workers, and several of them have been working for many, many years. Yet they are still classified as temporary workers and are deprived of pension and other benefits.

The impressive financial statistics of the department show that it has sound financial and capital structures as well as an effective management. The Department of Posts and Telecommunications is a candidate for privatisation, and privatisation is a powerful locomotive for economic growth and wealth creation. It should follow the successful pattern set by Iscor and Eskom in increasing efficiency and improving productivity.

In the final analysis any movement in this direction will enhance stability and thus lead to greater political stability in this country. In view of the difficult situation that our country faces insofar as raising capital on foreign markets is concerned, coupled with boycotts and sanctions, it becomes a high priority to monitor as close as possible the expenditure so that prudence becomes the watchword.

Mr Chairman, I am pleased to see that the hon the Minister is with us this afternoon. I am sure he is enjoying this debate a lot more than the finger-wagging party at the Tuynhuys which he was no doubt invited to. [Interjections.] The grapevine has spread a few words about it.

There are matters which I would like to raise this afternoon as well as a number which I am not going to have time for. I would like to speak particularly on two aspects which the De Villiers Report refers to as the traditional social communication needs of the people.

Telephone services and postal services fulfil what has become a fundamental need in society. I believe that communication at every level of society would be impossible without these two services. Not only would government, commerce and industry grind to a halt but more importantly the ordinary citizen would be deprived of what has become an essential ingredient in his or her daily life if these services were either curtailed or rendered unaffordable. This might sound like a fairly trite statement but it must not be lost sight of. I am concerned at the potential ill effects which could flow from the process of privatisation recommended in the De Villiers Report.

Obviously I do not need to say that we are in favour of privatisation. I think this is well-known. It is something which the PFP advocated long before Government stirred from its slumbers. We do, however, have many reservation as illustrated in the debate on the privatisation of the SATS about privatising essential services, in particular the conversion of a public monopoly with the advantage of a measure of parliamentary control to a private monopoly.

Dr Wim de Villiers is to be commended for an in-depth study of the complex and problematical process of attempting to privatise our communications system. It would be presumptuous of me, as a layman in this field, to attempt a critical analysis of his recommendations, most of which I believe has considerable merit. I am, however, most concerned that the small man, the ordinary telephone subscriber, the housewife, the pensioner and other housebound citizens may just be forgotten about in the process of technological innovation, structural reorganisation and eventual privatisation.

In our present system where posts and telecommunications still provide an essential service to our citizens at affordable rates, cross-subsidisation plays an important role. If this cross-subsidisation is to be eliminated—there is a lot to be said against cross-subsidisation—through the hiving-off of the value added, technologically sophisticated and more profitable services to private enterprise, how are we going to fund the service to the ordinary subscriber?

We all know that even at the increased tariff of R18, telephone rentals are highly subsidised. We also know that subscribers who make limited use of their phones—and this applies to a large section of domestic users—also provide little profit to the Post Office. The service is kept viable essentially by cross-subsidisation. If these profitable services are going to be hived off to private enterprise, we will either have to subsidise the social communication needs of the ordinary low-profit subscriber from State revenue— which means more taxes—or we will have to raise tariffs by substantial amounts to make this service cost effective. This will in turn make our telephone service unaffordable to a very large section of the lower income groups. The telephone is no longer a luxury. It is almost a basic human right, and I appeal to the hon the Minister to ensure that this right of the ordinary man and woman is not ignored.

I turn now to another aspect which has been an ongoing thing, namely the question of the metering of local calls. This was raised last year by the hon the Minister and I then expressed my concern.

Since then I have repeatedly made representations for this system to be reconsidered. I must admit that I am not alone in this. The Official Opposition’s spokesman in the House of Assembly referred to this issue. During the course of the past year since this was raised I have been telephoned and written to by people and organisations from all over the country asking me to please make appeals on their behalf. It was partly for this reason that I kept in communication with the Postmaster-General and the hon the Minister during the course of the past year.

This might seem like a small or petty issue but I believe that, to the person affected by this proposed system, it is of vital importance. It is of the utmost importance to each of the thousands of pensioners who have to make ends meet on inadequate State pensions or a dwindling return on investments battered by inflation.

I accept that a metering system for local calls may have to be introduced because of the commercial abuse to which it is presently subjected. It also seems that the Post Office will not be able to introduce a system which differentiates between commercial and private telephones so as not to disadvantage the legitimate user.

The hon the Minister has said—I am referring now to correspondence between myself and the Post Office—that the object of the time metering system is not to obtain additional revenue or limit the use of the telephone service. He goes on to say that as the vast majority of local calls last for less than 3 minutes it stands to reason that the time metering system will not add greatly to revenue. The hon the Minister has also said that they do not want to raise additional revenue by this means.

The primary objective is clearly to free lines which are presently being blocked by commercial undertakings for computer data transmission.

I believe there is a compromise, and when I say there is a compromise I have here with me a petition which was circulated in Port Elizabeth and which in a matter of three days collected over 1 000 signatures from people who specifically asked for what I suggested last year in correspondence to the hon the Minister be considered as a compromise. This is a very simple matter and I believe it can be implemented, viz that the initial charge period be for a period of 15 minutes, so as to allow a reasonable time for conversational use. A lot of us complain about teenagers or others who sit on a telephone and use it for conversational purposes, but this is an essential to the housebound, the lonely person, the pensioner or the old lady who wants to phone someone and who cannot get down the street or drive a motor car. I would therefore suggest a 15 minute period for the first metering unit and charge for that time. I am not saying that the Post Office should not charge for it. Thereafter it can be followed with shorter periods of say three minutes.

This system would effectively eliminate the commercial malpractices of blocking lines, it would raise additional revenue on lengthy phone calls— at the moment we are not charging for lengthy phone calls, except for one unit—and it would not add an additional financial burden onto the already overburdened pensioners.

The Postmaster General has rejected the suggestion, stating that it would erode the Post Office’s revenue. However, that makes nonsense of what I have been told in correspondence. The purpose is not to raise revenue. Surely this cannot be. At present every local call can go on for an unlimited time at a charge of 1:5 units depending on the distance factor. One call, one fee. Exactly the same fee will be recovered under my suggestion for the first 15 minutes and thereafter we will have additional revenue. By comparison with the proposed standard metering time unit my proposal of an initial 15 minute period should make little difference to revenue as it is common cause that the vast majority of calls last less than three minutes.

I again appeal to the hon the Minister and the Postmaster General to consider my suggestion. It is not only my suggestion; it is the suggestion of hundreds of thousands of people throughout this country who really cannot take any more in the way of additional charges.

An additional R15 or R20 or whatever it might cost to make use of the phone for conversational purposes just cannot be afforded by a lot of people. It is an enormous extra burden.

I would also like to talk briefly about the question of tariff increases. The reason given for tariff increases is that it was anticipated that there would be a R26 million operating deficit. They now intend imposing tariffs which in fact will raise over R200 million by way of an operating surplus. In other words, it is over ten times the amount required to meet the problem. I just cannot understand that. I cannot understand why we have to have tariff increases of the size we have where for the last two years we have had substantial operating surpluses. In fact, last year the operating surplus was more than double the anticipated operating surplus—over R200 million in addition to what had been anticipated. Why cannot those operating funds—those excesses—be used to repay loans which may have to be raised again in order to meet this what is conceded to be fairly marginal estimated deficit of R26 million?

I just do not believe that there was any reason this year to raise tariffs, and the explanations which have been given to us are entirely unsatisfactory.

Mr Chairman, with regard to this debate, having gone through it and looking at the history of telecommunications, we find that it was used to give the Afrikaner the opportunity of uplifting his people “uit die agtergeblewe gebiede”, as it was put.

Since posts and telecommunications are going to move into the realm of deregulation and privatisation I just hope that the opportunity of creating jobs and thus the uplifting of people will also be extended, because in private concerns it is not the skin colour that counts any more; it is merit.

In the past our people never had the opportunity of holding jobs in the top echelons; they were mostly employed as unskilled labourers. It was only as late as in the previous decade that people of other race groups were given better positions. Then they were trained as postmasters. Prior to that, however, they were only used for the laying of cables and the digging of trenches. During the time of job reservation Whites had the opportunity to be employed in positions of white collar workers, and as such those Whites had a head start compared with people of other race groups.

If one looks at the top management structure today one will find it is top heavy with White officials. I have not come across a non-White regional manager or any person of colour in any other top echelon position. These positions were reserved for their White counterparts. The people of colour were mainly used for carrying out menial tasks.

Now that the Post Office has also been streamlined for privatisation, as I mentioned before, I hope that this situation will improve. As I have pointed out, it is only lately that these people have been trained as postmasters, inspectors et cetera. I hope that this opportunity will be used to lift our people from the mire in which they find themselves at present.

I am of the opinion that it is important that the polemics around the principle of upliftment and job opportunities should be looked at in a broad perspective. There is an unbalanced situation at the moment and the question that springs to mind is: when will people of colour ever be employed in those top positions?

In the summary of Dr De Villiers’s report he pointed out that every person must be provided with services which ought to be of the same quality and price. We find ourselves in areas which are largely undeveloped and where we do not have telephone services, which our people have to rely on so much—especially in the crime-ridden areas.

The question I wish to ask the hon the Minister is, in the event of posts and telecommunications looking into how economically viable the situation is and finding that it is not economically viable, will cross-subsidisation be phased out in the end? My plea is that whilst we still have large undeveloped areas, cross-subsidisation be used to enable our people to get the proper network. If the department feels that installing telephones in certain areas is not economically viable, will they consider not installing those services? Since posts and telecommunications will now become profit-oriented, this could even lead to our having to wait much longer before getting a telephone.

The situation that springs to mind is that of the Blue Downs area. There are plus-minus 1 000 families living in Blue Downs, where there are only 4 public telephones. Everybody living in this area has to converge on these 4 telephone booths. Often these people find that the telephone booths have been vandalised and that the telephones are out of order. So many pleas have been made by residents of the Blue Downs area for telephones.

One must bear in mind that Blue Downs is quite a distance from the town, but they have only four public telephones. I therefore feel that something definitely has to be done. Was it not possible for the Department of Posts and Telecommunications to lay its telephone cables when Eskom laid its cables and get on with their job so that when the electric power came through, the telephones would already be working? One now has approximately 1000 families and only four telephone booths. I would be happy if the hon the Minister would do something about this matter.

The problem there is once again that the Post Office says the telephone exchange is not yet ready. By the time they are ready I think that the people of Blue Do wns will have had to wait for up to eighteen months without a decent telephone service. I therefore hope that something can be done as soon as possible.

Regarding the uneconomic services provided in crime-ridden areas, it may happen that the new company which is to be formed decides not to install telephones over there, because it is not economically viable. The hon the Minister will please have to clear up this matter.

We have areas which are crime-ridden and it is therefore important for people to have telephones in order to maintain contact with the ambulance service, the police and others. However much emphasis is placed on cross-subsidisation, it will eventually mean that they apply the brakes and become more reluctant to install telephones. It changes the tempo at which things take place.

If one looks back a couple of years, one will remember that the Department of Posts and Telecommunications had a tremendous backlog. They speeded it up to such an extent that most of the areas were served, but development on our side is only now starting. The White areas do not have that problem, because they are fully developed.

My plea is that with regard to the development of Coloured and Black areas telephones should not be seen as a luxury. It is a necessity that we have these things there.

As far as telephone rentals are concerned, I feel this is a very steep increase. The only concession that one gets is for pensioners, but there is also another group. This is my plea in regard to the blind, who are not granted a concession. The blind cannot enjoy television, so the only things that they have are the radio and the telephone. I feel that in order to balance it out it should be possible that the concession be extended to the blind who have telephones.

Mr Chairman, the hon member who has just resumed his seat made one very valid point, and that is that there are still large areas and whole communities in our country that do not yet need the infrastructure supplied by the Post Office. Consequently, if that infrastructure were made available in those areas, the result would be a situation in which there was a temporary over-capacity in those areas. That is the subject on which I want to exchange a few ideas with hon members.

In his budget speech the hon the Minister mentioned the valuable investigation undertaken by Dr W J de Villiers into all aspects of Post Office policy, control and organisation. I want to link up with the hon the Minister’s words of appreciation. From time to time every organisation must do some stock-taking and adapt its strategy to present-day circumstances.

Talking about stock-taking, and since we are dealing with the Post Office, it is perhaps a good thing to refer to the fact that the CP will probably also have to do some stock-taking. If one looks at this telex I received about the results of the municipal election in Sasolburg where the CP. although it retained the ward, having mobilised its whole Transvaal electoral organisation, one sees that its total number of votes decreased by 5,3%. [Interjections.] One sees that it is time the Official Opposition took stock of its own situation. [Interjections.]

Since we are speaking about stock-taking, it is also true that no investigation can be divorced from the era in which that investigation is carried out. The economic climate, in particular, will have a major influence on a commercial organisation such as the telecommunications organisation. I therefore find it regrettable that this report is undated.

Those of us who are still closely involved in the investigation know that it was undertaken from the mid-eighties to the late years of that decade. The danger exists, however, that those who read the report at a later stage will accept all the findings as gospel and not bear in mind that normal economic fluctuations will unavoidably influence the reliability of the findings.

In fact, we are but a year or two away from that point in time when the report will be submitted, and already there are signs that the findings are not the last word on the provision of infrastructure and capital works. Dr De Villiers specifically singles out the Post Office for criticism on the grounds of what he terms excessive expenditure on capital expansion programmes in the years after 1983. Whilst the provision of telephone infrastructure, for example exchanges, cables,, etc, reasonably kept pace with demand up to 1982, he contends that since 1983 the utilisation of capacity in telephone exchanges decreased dramatically and that in 1991 it will only be 69,1%, as against the 87,1% in March 1984.

There is no doubt that there is temporary overcapacity in the provision of telephone services. In his speech the hon the Minister also indicated what steps were being taken to reduce this excessive provision and to eliminate it over a period of three years. Experience has already taught us, however, that the De Villiers Report is being unnecessarily pessimistic about a realistic growth rate in the demand when, on page 27 of the report, it projects a realistic growth rate of 5% in services and 5% in calls up to March 1995.

The fact is that the investigation coincided with a five-year period of economic slackness, from 1982 to late 1986, which would have coloured any observer’s judgment. The demand for telephone services, for example, decreased from 10% per annum in the early eighties to 2,84% in 1985-86. That was specifically when the De Villiers Report appeared. Since then it has again shown strong growth, as the following figures indicate. In the year after the 2,84% increase in demand—ie in 1986-87—the growth in demand was 4,09%. In 1987-88 the growth was 4,73%. and the estimate for this year is 6%.

It was not merely the economic climate which influenced Dr De Villiers findings. My contention is that it seems as if he did not give enough weight to several factors which gave rise to this over-capacity, with the result that the report unfortunately creates the impression that capital expenditure since 1983 has taken place without proper planning. Time does not permit me to analyse all these factors, but since I have been involved with the Post Office throughout this period, I do want to mention a few of them.

Firstly, the older electro-magnetic exchanges, in particular, cannot be erected overnight. There are hon members of the committee who, on more than one occasion, have accompanied me on Post Office study tours. They will know that the accommodation of an old electro-magnetic exchange in a city like Pretoria took up several floors of a large building. Literally speaking, therefore, after the need for an exchange had been determined, it was first necessary to plan the building which was to house the exchange. That, and also the physical extent of the manufacturing and installation work, meant that the Post Office had to rely on five-year planning periods. This is a period which is much longer than that for which economic trends can be determined with any certainty.

The modern digital exchange is accommodated in apparatus hardly bigger than a normal refrigerator, the result being that installation and planning can be done in a much shorter time. The fact is that in his report Dr De Villiers was well aware of this fact. On page 32 he said the following: “One of the benefits of electronic exchanges is that they are easy to install and relocate.”

In fact, from this year onwards the principle of exchange engineering is also being implemented. In layman’s terms this means that one can install the framework of an exchange to meet one’s needs over a period of, let us say, four to six years, whilst only needing to incur expenditure every two years for the internal mechanisms or subscriber lines needed for the next year or two. The result is that with the introduction of modern electronic exchanges it is now possible to do much condensed short-term planning and therefore remain much closer to the actual needs for the ensuing one or two years.

As far as the second reason for over-capacity is concerned, even where digital exchanges can be installed over a shorter period than five years, at times this is altogether unavoidable. The fact is that these electronic exchanges are built in modules and that the modularity of such exchanges means that at times certain fixed-capacity exchanges have to be purchased which, for the present, naturally have to be larger, rather than smaller, than an area’s needs.

Then there is also the third consideration, ie that one must purposely install larger exchanges than are necessary, particularly in the rural areas where one has to go on working with the electromagnetic or older kinds of exchanges. At times rural areas develop more slowly than large metropolitan centres, and in many cases it will probably take many years before such rural areas are large enough to justify electronic exchanges.

Specifically because the electro-magnetic exchanges are so large and clumsy, it is a sound business principle to make those exchanges bigger than the immediate needs of such rural centres.

I could also mention other factors, for example the fact that one exchange area is sometimes used to furnish supplementary services to another area, which then creates the impression of excess capacity at one exchange. I could mention the unavoidability of overlapping in the process of conversion to the digital system. I could mention the fact that was mentioned by the previous speaker, ie that there are still large Black areas in our country which have to obtain infrastructure and in which an over-supply is initially unavoidable. I think, however, I have said enough to allow hon members to realise that over-capacity cannot always be avoided. In a growing society, economy and country over-capacity in such a rapidly growing industry such as that of the Post Office is not the greatest sin that an administration can commit either.

Mr Chairman, our Department of Posts and Telecommunications plays a vital role in the Southern African region, similar to that of the SA Transport Services. The Republic, being an integral part of Africa, is an important postal gateway and has telecommunication links to and from most countries on the African continent. We should be proud to have a sophisticated and well-maintained communication network—it is an absolute necessity for a stable economy in any country and essential for national and international trade and industry.

In many respects, the South African Department of Posts and Telecommunications has a legal prerogative and a responsibility to provide and maintain such services. Notwithstanding certain tactical difficulties and restraints, the Post Office is not only coping with present-day needs and requirements, but also planning for the future. Excellent postal arrangements exist with our neighbours, including the TBVC countries, South West Africa, the BSL countries and countries further to the north such as Zambia, Zimbabwe and Malawi.

I believe South Africa’s position as the hub of Southern Africa’s postal and telecommunications system is the country’s most powerful tool in overcoming political differences. We must continue to assist all countries in the sub-Sahara and we will soon be seen and recognized as the godfather of this region as far as vital services and supplies are concerned.

Although Indians entered the posts and telecommunications services in spite of discriminatory salaries and facilities, I am happy that most of these practices are something of the past. I appeal to the hon the Minister to scrap this practice where facilities are still segregated. This will remove the frustrations of people of colour.

I want to refer to an article from The Citizen dated 1 September 1988. The article refers to a post office legend, Dr Smiley Ballum, on his retirement after 37 years of service. It states that he started to work in the Post Office in 1951 as an ordinary labourer, rising through the ranks to a senior position in the planning division. Dr Ballum acquired two doctorates including one in psychology. High tribute was paid to Dr Ballum by Mr Martin du Preez, Civil and Mechanical Director of the Post Office. In turn Dr Ballum paid tribute to the Government for steadily opening Whites-only jobs to all.

I am sure that the hon the Minister and his department realise that there are many more Ballums in the Indian community who will be of service to their department. From this article one observes that a person’s colour makes no difference insofar as ability is concerned. But colour has been the criterion for far too long in our country. I must add that this phenomenon must be removed in all aspects of the South African way of life to enable us to attain peaceful coexistence and prosperity for all, which is our ultimate goal.

The training department plays a major role in staff upliftment and provides vast sums of money for bursaries, diploma courses, technical and functional training and recently began providing study loans to children of staff members, which is commendable. This will enable them to enter the job market better equipped.

In addition research is being done on a continuous basis in order to offer courses of a high standard. The general management, communication and senior leadership courses have already been evaluated and adapted to satisfy current needs. A course in corporate planning was developed, and to address the question of negotiation skills a project was launched in collaboration with the Human Sciences Research Council, which augurs well for the personnel. It is noteworthy that the lowest-paid employee of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications earns over R6 000 per annum.

I want to highlight the role played by this department in the social welfare field this afternoon. The Post Office collected a total of R1 638 370 towards the Flood Disaster Fund with the special surcharge stamp campaign. This is highly commendable. I do hope that this vast sum of money was distributed among all sections of the community who suffered losses during the floods. In addition to this flood relief involvement the usual annual Christmas Stamp Fund raised a million rand for the first time and distributed it among various organizations. I want to record my sincere gratitude to all the staff involved in these fund-raising efforts.

All previous speakers have commented on the budget hikes. This department, like the SATS, attributes the increases in rentals and postage to the 15% increase in staff salaries, the increase in inflation and lower rand exchange rate. These increases are a pity because I believe a telephone is no longer a luxury but a necessity, as was also said by the hon member for Groote Schuur and another hon member to my left. I feel particularly sorry for the aged and lonely pensioners and people who live in remote areas who have to use this facility in cases of emergency and in order to keep in contact with their family and friends.

It is a pity that because of time constraints I am not able to deal fully with the achievements and improvements as well as the shortcomings as they affect my community.

I want to place on record my sincere thanks and appreciation to the hon the Minister, the Director-General and senior staff for all the assistance given to me. I wish Mr Johan van Rensburg and Mr Robbie Raath—they are retiring from the Department after rendering 94 years of service between them—good health to enjoy their well-earned retirement.

Mr Chairman, I can only reaffirm what the hon member for Umzinto said about telephone services for the poor and aged. This was also mentioned by many other hon members. I think we have to accept the fact that, for the underprivileged and pensioners, the telephone is also their wheels. It is their means of communicating with their children and so on.

We acknowledge the fact that the hon the Minister did make a concession regarding the installation fees. However, where such a concession has been made, such people’s rentals can surely also be reduced, since the concession is tantamount to admitting that they cannot afford the normal fees. If one makes only 30 to 40 calls per month, the rental of R18 per month seems exorbitant.

Are you pleading for higher taxation?

We can discuss that later when I deal with what the hon member for Boksburg said about the whole question of crosssubsidisation.

†The so-called foreign exchange losses suffered by the Post Office and also by the SATS gave rise to a lot of recrimination and the pointing of fingers at this hon Minister and the hon the Minister of Transport Affairs. The so-called losses of the department of this hon Minister amounted to about R1,5 billion and in the case of the SATS it was R3 billion. Management was accused of incompetence and both hon Ministers were virtually “fired" by their critics.

Much sympathy was also expressed for the users of transport and communication services who must, after all, pay for this in terms of higher tariffs in order to balance the books. One of the suggestions was that privatisation could be the solution to the problem because private sector companies cannot afford to incur such losses through so-called incompetence because they would go bankrupt. I think this is a fallacious argument because we are not arguing here about two firms competing for the same business where if the one makes a bad decision and the other not the one that made the bad decision goes out of business. Here we are talking about a whole sector or the whole communications system.

We have, however, several questions arising from the foreign exchange losses. Firstly, who is to blame for the so-called loss; secondly, who pays for this loss; and thirdly, what could have been done to avoid it? The facts are quite simple in that this department, in order to do its work, must import equipment. To do this they have to take out loans or order equipment priced at the exchange rate at the time of the transaction. Of course, when the loan is due or when the equipment must be paid for they have to do this at the exchange rate at that specific time.

If we take a loan of 1 000 million dollars in 1984, which was then worth about R1,1 billion, that same loan required 2,8 million Rubicon rand to be paid back in 1986, thus resulting in a so-called loss of R1,7 million. There is also the argument that they could have insured against these losses by taking out cover with the Reserve Bank. Even if one did take out this insurance, the Reserve Bank would have had to carry the loss. How do they carry the loss?

These people must of course remember that they are the ones who own the printing press. Unfortunately, the value of their paper is not determined by them or by the hon the Minister but by the world at large. So who pays for the loss? All the citizens of South Africa, of course. Who is to blame? Not the hon the Minister, but whoever caused South African rand to become Rubicon rand.

Mr Chairman, as a result of problems experienced by the Department of Post and Telecommunications, the then Minister was forced to appoint a committee in 1972 to investigate the obtaining of capital for the Post Office, for example.

The chairman of this committee was Dr Franzsen, and the following people were members of the committee: Mr Louis Rive, who was the Postmaster-General at the time, Mr Campbell-Pitt, who represented the private sector, Mr Browne, the head of department with regard to finance, and Dr Boyce.

I made a brief study to determine whether the implementation of the proposals worked and improved the position of the Post Office. The most important recommendation made by this committee was that the Post Office should strive, by increasing tariffs gradually, to reach and maintain a position where not more than 50% of new capital investment would be financed from loan funds.

I undertook this study just to see how much progress had been made in the Post Office. Capital investment by the Post Office since 1982 is as follows. In 1982-83, 37,2% of the Post Office’s own funds and 62,8% of borrowed funds was invested. In 1983-84 it was 54,6% from own funds and 45,4% from borrowed funds. In 1984-85 it was 50% from own funds and 50% from borrowed funds. In 1985-86 it was 33% from own funds and 67% from borrowed funds. In 1986-87 it was 43,9% from own funds and 56,1% from borrowed funds. In 1987-88 it was 80,9% from own funds and 19,1% from borrowed funds. In 1988-89 it was 84% from own funds and 16% from borrowed funds. For 1989-90, the figures point to 76,8% from own funds and 23,2% from borrowed funds.

I want to go on to another aspect. We are discussing the proposals of Dr Wim de Villiers today, but since I am not going to have enough time, I merely want to draw the following to the hon the Minister’s attention. I appeal for the equalisation of all allowances, especially the camp allowance.

We have the problem that White and Black Post Office workers have to leave their families to go and do certain work elsewhere. I was in a similar situation myself, and I know what it feels like to leave one’s family at home on a Monday morning and to go far away for a week, a few weeks or perhaps a month. It is an enormous sacrifice, and that is why I am appealing for these people to receive equal remuneration. I feel it must be placed on the same level, especially if the workers have the same training and qualifications.

Something else that worries me is the Post Office vehicles that are stolen. The report says that 118 vehicles were stolen, of which 22 were found again. The loss incurred was R1,5 million. I am very concerned about this. Even better preventive measures should be taken by the department in order to overcome this loss.

Mr Chairman, the hon member for Groote Schuur produced a great argument against metering time in local calls. He referred to petitions containing many signatures and the thousands of calls which he had received. I want to tell him that it is only the parents of children who are concerned about the metering of local calls. It is the fathers of children who do their homework over the telephone or the fathers of grown-up children who conduct their courtships over the telephone. [Interjections.]

There has been considerable reference today to the De Villiers Report and to privatisation. There has also been reference to the fact that according to the inquiry the Post Office will be divided into two divisions to be operated independently. On the one side is the Telcom Division which consists chiefly of telecommunications and all related matters and the other is the Postal and Savings Bank Division.

The question now arises why there should be two separate divisions. It is as well then to look at the differences in character between these two divisions. Ninety-eight per cent of the Post Office staff work in one of the two divisions, that is in Telcom or the Postal and Savings Bank Division. The character of these two divisions differs enormously.

As regards the capital intensity of the two undertakings, Telcom is 97,2% capital intensive—that is R8 492 million—against the R246 million or 2,8% invested in the Postal and Savings Bank Division.

The use of labour in the two divisions is reflected in the following information. Telcom employs 62 000 members of staff and the Postal and Savings Bank Division 31 000 but the labour bill for the two divisions is R1 186,7 for Telcom and R14 500,7 million for the Postal and Savings Bank Division. That is more than double but there are not more than double the number of members of staff which merely indicates that the officials who work for Telcom are highly qualified people, engineers among others, who obviously earn a higher salary. Telcom revenue is estimated at R4 506 million at the end of this financial year which is 88,5% of the revenue of the department as against R864 million or 11,5% as the contribution to revenue by the Postal and Savings Bank Division. This indicates that these two divisions differ entirely in character and operation but that does not mean that one department or component is more important than the other. I think that all hon members will agree that the Postal and Savings Bank Division is just as important as the Telcom Division.

The following is of further interest. To indicate the differences between these two divisions, intensity indexes were extracted by the staff by dividing capital invested in the two divisions by revenue generated. In this way an index can be compiled of labour and capital intensity per R1 by revenue generated by each of the undertakings. It costs the Telcom division 30 cents to earn R1 whereas the postal side requires 81 cents in labour costs to earn R1. According to the current budget, capital invested in the Telcom Division represents R2,13 to earn R1. In the Postal and Post Office Savings Bank Division it requires 48 cents to earn R1.

In the use of personnel, Telcom requires 15,6 members of staff to generate revenue of R1 million whereas 60,2 members of staff are required in the Postal and Savings Bank division. This indicates the difference between the two departments. I shall also attempt to indicate how possible and desirable it is to privatise Telcom and that is why it is not possible to privatise the Postal and Savings Bank Division at the moment and in future.

I want to point out to the hon member for Ventersdorp and hon members on the side of the Opposition, who launched such verbal attacks on the increase in tariffs in the Postal Division, that the expected loss for the current financial year amounts to R132 million in the Postal and Savings Bank Division as against a profit of R920 million in the Telcom Division.

Before we can get the Postal and Savings Bank Division to break even by cancelling out the increased tariffs through savings and can show a profit, we shall not be able to privatise the Postal and Savings Bank Division. It is estimated that Telcom’s net profit before tax will be R920 million at the end of this month, that is the end of the financial year.

Losses that will be shown by the Postal and Savings Bank component will be R132 million at that stage, which does not make its privatisation possible. If Telcom can produce a profit of R920 million, which is generated from an income of R4 506 million, it means that the hon the Minister of Finance gains R460 million in tax out of which he can make good the R132 million of the Postal and Savings Bank Division and still retain R330 million.

I evaluated this. The value of capitalising profits at an interest rate of 15% against Telcom’s R920 million will give us R6 133 million. If we can sell Telcom for rand shares we shall have an income of R6 133 million and hon members can think what we could do with that.

Mr Chairman, I do not support the tariff increases for Post Office services. It is unfortunate that the Post Office had to resort to this measure in order to balance their books. We must realise that the consumer, that is the man in the street, has to bear the brunt of these increases and he has to carry the burden.

Tariff increases must be looked at in the light of all other increases. The hon the Minister admits that tariff increases will add to rising inflation, at least in the Post Office. Inflation is biting private telephone subscribers. Therefore the metering of local telephone calls will be a disaster. It will do away with one privilege which is presently enjoyed by the general public.

What does this imply? Firstly, social and personal calls will be affected. The use of a telephone will become a liability rather than an asset. It will discourage new telephone subscribers. More and more people will surrender the service. The anticipated growth in telephone connections for the Black community will be curtailed.

Let us look at the repercussions. The metering of telephones will definitely have serious implications for the Post Office budget and capital and operating accounts.

The capital investment will suffer further losses as a result of increasing demands on the services. The operating costs will escalate. The Post Office may have to retrench personnel.

However, there is a possible remedy. The Department of Posts and Telecommunications should be granted the opportunity to remedy the situation and in this respect I would like to refer to the De Villiers Report and its recommendations. The De Villiers Report affords excellent suggestions in regard to the operation of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications on business principles. These recommendations could be adopted by the department. It should not only adopt those recommendations; it should also put them into operation. I feel that the department has been dragging its feet in adopting and effecting the recommendations of the De Villiers Report for the past two years. After all, this report has been in existence for two years.

The department has not been operating on sound business lines. It has not given serious thought to the planning, preparation and the execution of the privatisation of certain components of the Post Office as an immediate start. One of the many defects in the department’s operation, I believe, is in the productivity of its personnel. I feel that staffing operations are one big bureaucracy, a bureaucracy that costs the department 29% or R2,2 million of the total Budget to operate, which is a substantial amount of money.

If it pays almost one third of its investments as salaries, then we expect a fair and reasonable return. It would seem that vast sums of money have been utilized with non-returns, hence the increase in the Budget.

For the information of hon members I would like to give the following statistics regarding the payment of salaries and wages. Plus-minus 13 500 staff earn salaries ranging from R2 000 to R5 000 per month while 82 000 earn between RO and R2 000.

About 20% of the total salary budget is earned by only 5 000 staff equivalent to some R270 million. Approximately 5 000 Post Office personnel earn an average of R45 000 per annum. When one looks at the 15% increase, that money has gone to the white-collar worker and not to the ordinary man in the lower ranks. I am talking about the labourer, unskilled worker and the small money earner. I can understand the hon the Ministers dilemma. After all, he is sitting with a bureaucracy that cannot be overcome overnight. It has been the tradition of the Government to maintain a public service of white-collar workers. In this regard I would emphasize productivity. Production should be the yardstick by which the operations should be made cost-effective. To be productive, the department must scrutinize the activities with a fine comb. Both management and staff should pull up their socks.

I do understand that the Post Office employs very large number of people and they have to operate in many areas and in many situations in remote areas but there should be incentives to increase productivity. I do not want to give examples of people being unproductive but I think, with so much money being spent on staff and salaries … [Time expired.]

Mr Chairman, first permit me to reply to the hon member for Boksburg who is so concerned that he will not carry the day when there is an election later. He is so worried because he says that there are so many people faced with supposed bankruptcies but I want to invite him to Witbank. I shall show him that there are at least 20 to 30 households in Witbank who have to leave their homes as a result of this Government’s disastrous policy.

I believe that the officials of this department are the most disciplined of those of all departments. A high degree of responsibility is discernable, especially among the Whites of this department. We want to say thank you to this exceptional staff for their willingness to furnish good service. The country may regard itself as fortunate in having such officials in the Department of Posts and Telecommunications.

It is no wonder that the Post Office complains that SATS is not equally efficient. According to Die Transvaler of 23 February 1989 the Postmaster General said:

It therefore appears that delays in getting post to the right place cannot be laid at the door of the Post Office alone but can frequently also be blamed on SATS.

While thanking the officials, I am disappointed in the hon the Minister at the same time. I was disappointed when I read the De Villiers Report. I had always thought that the hon the Minister could handle his department well. Yet I made a tragic discovery. After I had read his Budget Speech and just afterwards examined Dr De Villiers’s report very closely, I wondered whether it was the same department. What I find tragic is that the hon the Minister did not mention the many problems in this department. On the other hand, the summarised report on the study by Dr De Villiers is riddled with criticism, especially Chapter 2 and 3 of Part 2 and Chapter 1 of Part 3. I shall quote only a few parts of it. In the balance sheet, on page [iii] of the report, we see for instance:

As regards the use of telephones, one finds on page 27 of the report:

There is mention on page 33 of overprovision which indicates considerable unnecessary capital investment in connection with electronic exchanges. On the subject of “hidden demand” we see on page 38:

The point at issue here is a possible demand for telephones. Proof is furnished that the forecast of 19% was a guestimate here. The actual figure was 4,1% in 1986-87. That guestimate was taken further in the next year, in which the forecast was 20,3% whereas the actual growth rate was 4,7%.

On page 44 it is mentioned that the overcapacity of telephone services can be attributed to mistaken investment since 1978. I quote what the report has to say about this:

I see on page 50 that it is crucial that a different direction be examined from that which was planned in connection with manual exchanges. The present critical position of Posts and Telecommunications is due to overexpenditure on unutilised telecommunications equipment according to the De Villiers Report.

There are also certain points in the hon the Minister’s Appropriation which must be mentioned. The question is why the rental of telex machines has decreased by between R30 and R75 a month. We accept that fax machines are more popular but have the machines shown so much profit that it is possible to give a discount now? Or is it merely to recover a few rands out of the huge loss? The question then arises involuntarily why the cost of telegrams has suddenly soared. A 40%-increase took place overnight—from R2,50 to R3,50 per telegram. Then the hon the Minister still says that inflation has not really been aggravated.

According to the Appropriation a very large part of the department’s revenue is generated by telecommunications services—especially telephones. Now the hon the Minister informs the House that approximately 270 000 telephones, extensions, etc will be installed this year but it is expected that there will be a waiting list for 119 000 telephones by 31 March 1989. My question is why we have such a waiting list. Why do we not care better for the goose that lays the golden eggs? Why is there a delay of up to six months before a telephone is installed? I think a good source of revenue is being neglected or ignored here.

In country districts, especially in the Eastern Transvaal with its high rainfall, we have an additional problem that humidity frequently makes the telephone network totally unserviceable. Are we just going to accept this or does the hon the Minister and his department perhaps have a solution to improve matters?

I also want to say a few words here on marine radar development and marine electronic technology. As they fall under the department and it is a field which is changing very rapidly, I want to ask whether our training keeps abreast with that found overseas. I have been told that the international world is of the opinion that South Africa is lagging far behind. Is the staff provided with sufficient opportunity to keep abreast in modern technology? Are they not falling behind as regards modern technology? I request the hon the Minister to take note of this important aspect, please. As a country we cannot afford to allow situations to arise owing to outdated techniques which we could have prevented.

I also note that the Government is in a big hurry to privatise. Will the funds which are received also be used for Black schools, as the hon the Minister of Education and Development Aid said? Does the hon the Minister intend getting rid of an asset which provides the Treasury with a good income in order to build thousands of Black schools and provide millions of people with an education without their having a shred of hope of ever having a job?

Mr Chairman, I want to refer firstly to the metering of calls because this is a very contentious subject in our community. I agree with the hon member for Groote Schuur when he says that a telephone can no longer be considered a luxury today, but indeed a necessity.

He made mention of elderly people who have to rely on the telephone to make contact with their families. This is so. However, people get upset when they receive accounts which they cannot afford to pay, especially when they feel that they did not really make much use of the service or that they did not make all the calls that appear on the account and that they took all the necessary steps to ensure that no-one else used the telephone in their absence. For example, people often lock or disconnect their telephones and lock them away in their wardrobes. When they go out they even lock the room in which the telephone was locked away. However, they still receive these accounts.

When people come to me with complaints, I go to the post office and ask them to investigate the matter, but they always come back with the answer that there is nothing wrong with their metering system, that their meters are in perfect working order and that subscribers just have to pay their accounts or else their telephones will be disconnected. This is causing hardship and I am sure that we will have to look at other ways of metering calls more accurately.

I go along with the suggestion of the hon member for Groote Schuur, namely that a subscriber should pay a certain amount for the first five minutes, a little more per minute for the next five minutes and so on. This will curtail unnecessary discussions over the telephone. In this way people will refrain from having seminars over the phone.

I now come to the postal delivery service. In the past few years we have seen a phenomenal improvement in postal delivery services. A person does not have to wait for a week for the arrival of a letter which he is expecting. If a person phones somebody and tells him that he does not have his account or that he has not received a letter, the other person will say that it is in the post and lo and behold, the next day or the day thereafter he will receive that letter.

In the five minutes that I still have at my disposal, I would like to talk about the extension of the delivery services to the new housing development areas.

This has also proceeded apace. Where these houses are built it is up to the municipalities to see that the roads are there and that there are letterboxes for the receiving of these letters—maybe the householder himself should see to that and see to it that the Post Office is notified immediately so that postal delivery services can be instituted at such a place in a matter of time. I want to congratulate the department again on the very good work they have done in this connection.

Mr Chairman, I wish to associate myself with the reservations already expressed regarding the manner in which the hon the Minister has over-reacted by increasing certain tariffs. Although I realise at the same time that this is largely an attempt to reduce the effects of cross-subsidisation with a view to future privatisation I am also aware that the De Villiers Report criticised the principle of cross-subsidisation. I must warn the hon the Minister that the telecommunication system in this country has not developed or advanced to the stage where it is practical arbitrarily to do away with cross-subsidisation.

It is in this context that I wish once again to take issue with the hon the Minister regarding the inadequacy of telephone communication services in many rural areas. In doing so I want to stress in the first place that there remains an urgent need for increased telephone facilities to be established in the Black rural areas and here I refer particularly to KwaZulu and the South African Development Trust areas in Natal. One has only to visit these areas to appreciate the enormous communication difficulties with which the local inhabitants have to contend, solely becaúse of the serious lack of available facilities. The difficulties experienced in the making of a single telephone call by people living in these areas has to be seen to be believed.

I have also taken note of the information contained in the Budget speech of the hon the Minister, which indicated that the number of telephones per 100 dwellings had increased from 1978 to 1986 in Black rural areas from two to 14. I want to tell the hon the Minister that I have grave misgivings with regard to the accuracy of this information in that these figures do not conform to my own observations. I would go so far as to say that the hon the Minister’s estimates have been exaggerated and bear no relationship to the factual position.

Similarly I must draw the hon the Minister’s attention to the unsatisfactory situation that exists in areas that are reliant on manual exchanges for their telephone services. Let me make it quite clear that I am not pointing a finger at the operators of these exchanges, most of whom work under difficult conditions and who go beyond the requirements of duty in serving the public. The point I wish to stress is that the hon the Minister, through his department, must take more effective steps to expedite the phasing out of manual exchanges. I am aware of the high cost involved in the conversion of an exchange from manual to automatic and the fact that only five new automatic exchanges were installed during the year under review. [Time expired.]

Mr Chairman, I want to endorse fully the plea made by the hon member for Mooi River when he said that there was a great need to provide for effective telephone services in the rural areas of Natal, particularly in KwaZulu. That hon member, as indeed did the hon member for Greytown, referred to the report of the De Villiers Commission. I want to say that the report of Dr Wim de Villiers has highlighted in a constructive yet in a very penetrating way gross inefficiencies in the Department of Posts and Telecommunications. It has exposed bureaucratic blunders of the worst kind which have resulted in an immense forex loss for which the country is paying a brutal price.

I know it has been said that the hon the Minister is not responsible for this but in fact it is the very system of apartheid that exists in this country that has been the real cause of this. This is a problem that needs to be addressed very positively.

The question that arises is: Why did the department send unqualified officials abroad to raise foreign capital in a deadly foreign exchange market where even specialist institutions like banks could not always keep their footing? Why was it necessary for the department at a time when this country is short of capital to treat capital as an unlimited, low cost resource and to involve itself in capital projects which were unnecessary, expensive and uneconomic?

The report has suggested that had the department been privatised, and hence run on sound economic and business principles, it would not have incurred these heavy foreign exchange losses or spent beyond its means. The hon the Minister obviously is in agreement as indeed he has already indicated, that privatisation is desirable but then he protests that because of the debt burden privatisation of sections of his department is at least three years away.

This reasoning is beyond me. If the department is not to be privatised, how then does the hon the Minister hope to discharge the tremendous debt that the department has incurred? Does the hon the Minister intend to listen to the Government’s adviser on privatisation or not? Does he believe that the department’s problems will be waved away by a policy of procrastination? The hon the Minister needs to address these issues both positively and credibly.

I wish now to turn to a matter where the department has made some progress but which regrettably is not enough. I am referring to the question of the design and creation of postage stamps, special date stamps, commemorative envelopes and other philatelic items.

Given the wide and diverse socio-political and historical background of our nation and the rich heritage of all its people, I believe that not enough is being done in this regard to reflect this when stamps are printed.

We must not forget that the process of nationbuilding has to take place at every level and at every opportunity and appropriate stamps can play an important role in this regard.

Turning to the question of staff matters. I am concerned about the recent statement by the hon the Minister that there were 5 958 vacancies in the Post Office at the end of last year and that 6 449 employees had resigned last year. Is there something wrong with the staff morale which has led to this high turnover, and what is the department doing to rectify the situation?

I want to remind the hon the Minister that if he intends to go the privatisation route, he will have to address this problem in the same manner that others in the private sector do.

Finally I note that in Natal post offices are being built at Dalton. Durban North, Eshowe, Harding. Kokstad and Shallcross. May I ask the hon the Minister what has happened to the promised post office at Reservoir Hills?

Mr Chairman, I am pleased to be speaking after the hon member. I just want to say one or two things about certain remarks that were made.

It is true that the 6 000 people who resigned represented a very small percentage of the total labour force, and if this is taken as a percentage of the total labour force, the turnover is very low.

By way of providing information. I should also just like to react to the hon member for Witbank with regard to the training of Post Office personnel. In fact I want to do so by pointing out certain achievements of trained Post Office personnel. When one talks about training and keeping abreast of present-day technology from abroad, this in no way implies that we can be totally self sufficient. When we have to decide whether something can be produced here or not, we must take into account whether or not it is economically viable to produce the article here. When it is so expensive that it cannot be done, other sources should rather be considered. Nevertheless, what is attainable, is done.

The Post Office spent approximately R12 million on research and development. I am now talking about approximate figures because the amount is concealed in the rest of the budget—it is spread over the entire budget. Of that amount approximately R6 million was used by the Post Office’s own laboratories for the development of certain apparatus and for the research which preceded this. The department granted R1 million to universities for research which was done, and approximately R5 million was granted to the CSIR and private concerns.

This funding resulted in the development of an interface unit which gives owners of personal computers access to telex and teletex networks. The unit was developed because the popularity of the telex machines has actually declined considerably since the facsimile apparatus was introduced. This loss of clients is hopefully being compensated for to a large extent by the provision of these interface units for personal computers. The networks are of a very good quality and it will be possible to put the available facilities to good use.

Secondly, more than 50% of the capital for the conversion of the remaining manual exchanges to automatic exchanges will have to be spent on the upgrading of party lines. In order to keep the cost as low as possible, the department has designed and developed a system which makes the use of one line possible while at the same time guaranteeing complete privacy. When this apparatus has been linked up, one will therefore, when using party lines, no longer hear the woman on the other side breathing heavily into the telephone while one is having a conversation with one’s wife. That, of course, is one of the great irritations of party lines.

With regard to coin validators when we introduce a new series of coins—no doubt this will happen one of these days—all the coin-box telephones will have to be replaced or adapted. These coin validators have been designed and built and will be installed as soon as the new series of coins are available. The advantage of these new machines—this is our own development—is that it will not be necessary to make new installations in the future when the coin systems are changed again. They will be adjusted at the local control point by means of a software programme in order to accept the new series of coins.

A further achievement of the Post Office is the development of the BTS-128 system: this is the business telephone system. The BTS-60 which is being used at the moment, has become too small for some of the larger businesses. This will be implemented in conjunction with local suppliers one of these days.

Furthermore, this department is responsible for considerable stimulation of local production in the local industry. In particular it has done the Eastern Cape a large favour. On 6 September 1985, the former Minister responsible for this department, officially commissioned the extension of the installation of Aberdare Cables in Port Elizabeth. This installation had to be expanded in order to provide for the fibreglass cables which the Post Office decided to use. At that stage the extensions cost R8 million.

This meant a great deal to the Eastern Cape economy, but, of course, the strategic importance of this cannot be measured in rands and cents—namely to be self-sufficient in something which we can produce ourselves, which is not more expensive than what we could import and for which the raw materials are readily available. After all, hon members are aware that sand is one of the raw materials. At least sand is much cheaper than copper ore, and more plentiful. It is true that the fibreglass cables offer a particular advantage over copper pairs. When telephone channels require more than 300 channels, the use of overhead telephone cables is no longer considered at all. The concentric cables, which can be compared to fibre cables, are far too expensive.

The capacity of fibreglass cables is absolutely phenomenal. When we are dealing with a cable pair with a diameter of 10 mm, that is to say two cables of 10 mm each, and the final apparatus for transmitting and receiving at 140 megabits per second, those two cables can handle 1 920 telephone calls at the same time. The 565-megabit systems are now being used at some points, and these have increased the capacity to as many as 7 680 two-way channels. This can still be increased by multiplexing frequencies and similar things.

The local market for optical fibre is very promising. The Department of Transport as well as private undertakings make much use of it. This fibreglass cable does not only have to be laid underground; it can also be placed overhead as a result of its light weight. Another advantage is that it can be obtained in lengths of two kilometres without joins. The installation equipment which we will need per year, is equal to the cost of the material. This amounts to between R40 million and R50 million each. Therefore, approximately R90 million is being pumped into trade and industry in this country every year by this department.

Finally I just want to say that we have a staff which is very helpful when information is requested, and in this regard I want to thank Mr Taylor in particular for this highly technical information which I was able to obtain through him.

Mr Chairman, I should like to join my hon colleagues in congratulating officials of the Post Office. It was 20 years ago that the Wiehahn Committee recommended, in 1968, that the Post Office should be granted financial autonomy. Since then the Post Office has progressed in leaps and bounds as an undertaking. Whereas the Post Office had an income of R146 million in 1968, this has increased to R465 million in the year under review. Operating expenditure increased from R122,5 million to R3 690 million. The turnover grew from R834 million to R16 953 million.

Another very important milestone was the provision of telephones to the public and the business sector. Here the figure increased from 1,2 million units to approximately 4,5 million.

The postal services also made tremendous progress in the technological field. Here I just want to mention afew outstanding achievements, such as the introduction of the South Atlantic undersea cable between the RSA and Portugal, the automation and mechanisation of mail processing in Johannesburg, Cape Town, Durban and Pretoria, as well as the introduction in the RSA of the first EWSD electronic telephone exchange in the world.

This is really an achievement of which the Post Office and South Africa can be proud. I also want to thank the staff of the Post Office in particular. I am referring specifically to the technical people and their assistants who worked tremendously long hours during the recent floods and devoted a great deal of time to making the transmission system in Natal, the Free State and the Northern Cape available to the public again in record time. If it is borne in mind that some towns were completely cut off and that the communication links were restored exceptionally quickly, one can only offer one’s sincere congratulations to the officials and staff of the Post Office on their excellent service.

I come now to the hon the Minister’s speech. Although I understand the needs of the postal services, it is difficult to believe that it was necessary to announce an increase in postage. Here I am referring specifically to the increase in the price of postage stamps. The poor people in the rural areas who do not have telephones are again those who are being hit hardest. Students and others who work and study in our urban areas and who can only get in touch with their parents by letter are also affected by this. Those are the ones who, on the other hand, have to write to their children and other members of their family here in the urban areas. These are the only means of communication. I am asking us not simply to increase the price of postage stamps in the future, since these people do not have access to telephone services and other ways of contacting distant members of their family.

The increase in the installation cost of telephones from R125 to R140 is a particularly large one. The hon the Minister has today heard how many representations have already been made in this regard, particularly as far as older people are concerned. We have read in the newspapers that there are too many old people in old-age homes who are still able to live on their own. For these people the telephone is absolutely essential. However, it is gratifying to note that the installation costs of telephones for social pensioners have not been increased. I am glad that the call-charges have not been increased either.

The hon the Minister thought fit not to say a great deal about staff matters in his speech. However, I want to mention that the full-time staff have decreased by 1,9% from 97 392 to 95 531.1 should also like to know how many part-time or casual workers are currently employed by the postal services.

With regard to the report of Dr Wim de Villiers I just want to say that I am and shall remain a champion of privatisation because I believe in healthy competition and the free-market system. Therefore Ī welcome the Government’s decision to accept Dr De Villiers’s recommendations. However I want to issue a warning that the funds which are going to be obtained through privatisation should not be used to keep the national economy going. Those funds should be used for further economic stimulation and the creation of job opportunities.

I am grateful that I have had the opportunity to participate in this debate.

Mr Chairman, my colleagues the hon members for Groote Schuur and Springfield spoke before this House today and touched on a number of issues.

The hon member for Groote Schuur dealt briefly with the postal and communications tariffs which have most certainly caused consternation in the minds of most South Africans.

I do not want to dwell at length on this issue other than to support fully what my colleague had to say when he questioned the need for the tariff increases that we will experience from April this year.

That the hon the Minister has seen fit to introduce these increases makes it obvious that the Government is anticipating yet again a high inflation rate for the year. Why else would such tariff increases be introduced despite the constant assurances to the public that last year the Post Office had a highly successful financial year? Indeed, we note and acknowledge record operating surpluses for the past two years—an upward trend which is most positive when viewed against some of the more dismal performances of the Post Office in years gone by.

We note too that the Postmaster General has stated on several occasions that he believed this upward trend would continue in the light of greater consumer use of all the facilities offered by the Post Office in both the postal and the telecommunications areas. So we must ask why these stiff tariff increases are necessary. I believe it is because the Government is expecting the already high inflation rate to continue to spiral this year. However, the Government must realize that by anticipating inflation in this way it is actually aiding and abetting the whole inflationary process. Anticipating inflation is in itself inflationary.

My colleague the hon member for Springfield touched briefly on the matter of the forex losses. The Post Office has, to some extent, tried to play this matter down as something beyond its control. The Department of Posts and Telecommunications refers to the matter as “misconceptions with regard to overseas loans and exchange rate losses". However, I believe that is too glib an excuse. The Government is simply not prepared to accept openly that forex losses are the direct result of their apartheid policy.

We are always looking to cure our ailments rather than prevent them in the first place. Forex losses are as much a part of this malaise as are all the other ailments we suffer from in this country.

It is therefore unacceptable to me for the Department of Posts and Telecommunications to try to pass the blame for such astounding losses on to situations they claim to be beyond their control. At the end of the day, forex losses are very much the result of the apartheid policies of this Government which has made South Africa the pariah nation of this world.

Without doubt these losses will in turn be passed on to the consumer in one way or another placing further burdens on his shoulders in various forms of additional taxation. I want to ask the hon the Minister whether he has any plans to actually lift the burden on the consumer in any way. Surely he will be prepared to look at ways and means of reducing overheads that the users of the various services have to pay. I want to give the hon the Minister an example. I know that he was approached in December last year by a constituent of mine, a woman who is also consumer affairs columnist for the Sunday Tribune. She wrote to him and pointed out that there is a monthly surcharge on any telephone attachment which is connected to telecommunication lines. This charge includes answering machines which receive calls only, an otherwise free facility apart from regular rentals. However, this service profits the Post Office with at least one incoming unit of 13,5 cents a call and this profit will be doubled when the call is almost certainly returned. This means an income of at least 27 cents a call for the Post Office without any extra outlay from the department.

Surely it would be possible for the hon the Minister to abolish surcharges on instruments such as these and so help the overburdened consumers. Such action would encourage subscribers to invest in items of equipment such as telephone answering machines and thereby benefit the Post Office further.

I believe that this is the kind of thinking that the Post Office needs to introduce. It cannot simply go on taking from the consumer without being prepared to make meaningful concessions as well, particularly when such concessions would inevitably be of benefit to the Post Office as much as they would be to the users of the Post Office’s services.

There is another matter which needs attention and that is the matter of telephone accounts. I certainly accept that generally telephone accounts as sent out by the Post Office are accurate and give little cause for complaint. The hon the Minister must, however, be aware that there are a growing number of complaints from telephone users with regard to accounts received which are grossly inconsistent with their usage of their telephones. In other words, accounts may well be received on a regular basis which are consistent— say between R40 and R50 per month—but suddenly an account will be received for an amount in excess of R300.

People involved in consumer affairs matters assure me—I have had letters to this effect—that they are receiving more and more complaints in connection with these grossly inflated telephone accounts. Consumers are equally concerned about the fact that the answers given by the Post Office when such obviously inaccurate accounts are queried are often totally unacceptable.

Concern does exist in the minds of many people as to whether the Post Office actually has any means of checking queries on accounts. The hon the Minister needs to reassure us on this matter. After all, the more expensive the service, the more entitled are the users of and the payers for that service to expect the very best in all respects—not least the proper handling of accounts.

This service is becoming more expensive and very rapidly so. Now we have the metering of local calls to contend with—something that will add greatly to the expense of the service. Will we as a result be guaranteed a more efficient service to go hand in hand with this increased expense?

On the issue of metered local calls the hon member for Groote Schuur expressed his concern over the additional burden this will place on. among other groups, the elderly. I must say that I believe this is a far more significant point than the one made by the hon member for Hercules in reply when he tried to support the metering of local calls by referring to children doing their homework over the phone. I found that a rather trite excuse.

I want to put another point to the hon the Minister. What does he intend doing with regard to members of the public making calls to Government departments? Surely he must make these calls unmetered calls.

He must know of the tremendous delays one experiences when one telephones a Government department. One has to find the right person to take one’s particular complaint or query. He must know that this can take upwards of 10 minutes. For such calls to be metered would. I believe, be a travesty of what is right. I fear it may well result in the Post Office unfairly boosting its revenue by perhaps millions of additional rand every year. I certainly ask the hon the Minister to consider this point, unless he too has seen— perhaps with a gleam in his eye—this opportunity to increase his department’s revenue considerably.

Mr Chairman, on the surface the picture that emerges from the Post Office Budget is that the Department of Posts and Telecommunications is in a healthy state, or appears to be. considering an anticipated operating surplus of almost R539 million which, I might add. is more than double the original estimate. This is indeed very flattering. What is more is that the Post Office has begun reducing capital programmes in order to minimize under-utilisation. This can be seen in the reduction of the capital budget for the coming financial year. The hon the Minister has said that the rental for telex and telefax services was being decreased by between R30 and R75 per month in order to stimulate demand for these services. There are other benefits too, which the hon Minister announced and which hon members are familiar with.

All this is very commendable except that there has been a wide range of increases which will come into effect on 1 April. What perturbs me is that an increase in tariffs is directly contrary to the advice of leading economists and the invariable experiences of countries which have increased public revenues and the gross national product by reducing tariffs.

The good thing about the Budget, however, is that it s possible for one to deal with in on the plane of reason. I believe that few increases have been levied at the whim, fancy or humour of the hon the Minister.

We are dismayed about the metering of local calls. In some Western countries local calls are free of charge and it may perhaps be an idea to enquire as to how this is being done. Injustices like the outdated party-line system would also be redressed by means of technical modifications that could ensure privacy.

There is, however, a third feature of the Budget, namely the increase in postage tariffs, which is bound to result in the Budget proving to be depression oriented instead of being growth oriented, as envisaged by its authors. I would therefore like to submit that the solution to our budgeting problem which would avoid both deficit financing and hefty tariff increases cannot be found by the hon the Minister alone but can lie in a concerted action by the entire Government.

While the limits of our resources are objective and painfully apparent, our needs are what our planners and economic experts subjectively say they are. Planning according to our needs has been tried, and it has often failed dismally. Our economy, which has been badly mauled, has great recuperative strength and will respond surprisingly to generous and realistic treatment.

Sir, I am not going to indulge in the hackneyed clichés and rhetoric and blame it on this Government’s race policies. I do not believe that the mandarins are so ignorant or naive as not to know to what extent prejudices have undermined our economic growth.

Finally I am tempted to say that the hon the Minister’s speech was more stimulating than his Budget proposals. I believe the taxpayer would have preferred more relief.

At the same time I am not unmindful of the fact that taxes and other forms of revenue are the lifeblood of any government. However, it cannot be overlooked that the blood is taken from the arteries of the taxpayer. Therefore the transfusion is not to be accomplished by the dictates of political expediency but in accordance with the principles of conscience and justice.

Mr Chairman, the hon member for Moorcross must excuse me if I do not respond to his speech. However, I should just like to say a few words about the argument put forward here by the hon member for Durban North to the effect that the Department of Posts and Telecommunications and the Government had such an indifferent approach to inflation in the recent budget. This is definitely not the truth.

The Government has taken up the fight against inflation, and in 1988 we succeeded in bringing the inflation rate down to below 12%. The struggle against inflation continues this year, but I want to point out that it is not the duty of the Government alone to try to keep inflation in check. We shall not succeed if all of us in the country do not take up the struggle against inflation too.

I am pleased to be participating in this debate. Hon colleagues who have already spoken have congratulated staff of the department and thanked them for their services. I should like to join in these congratulations. Today I also want to thank a particular group of the department’s staff who, during the flood damage in 1988, and in my region in particular, performed a mammoth task in order to make the country’s communications system functional again in that area.

In the Northern Cape approximately 3 000 staff members were involved in the repair of installations belonging to the department which had been damaged by the flood.

In the Douglas-Ritchie area 700 km of telephone routes, destroyed by the flood, were repaired. Three hundred poles were replaced, and the cost in that small area was approximately R750 000. In the Northern Cape R1,8 million was spent on repair work to the infrastructure of the Post Office. We extend our sincere thanks for this dedicated service on the part of the staff of the Department of Posts and Telecommunications.

As previous speakers have done I must also refer to the manual exchanges and farm-line telephones. I do not want to cover the whole aspect again, but I want to tell hon members we would be very sad to say goodbye to the manual exchange staff at our small towns. A special era in the culture of our people will be lost when there is no longer a Connie or a Lewies at the exchange who can be called and asked to put one through to a certain place. I remember that on 27 May 1948 a man in Britstown picked up the telephone at eight o’clock at night, called the exchange and said: “I want to speak to Jan Smuts and I will hold on.” That telephone call was put through. I should like to pay tribute to these people.

Nevertheless we in the rural areas also have problems as far as telephone services are concerned, mainly with apparatus. I put it very earnestly to the hon the Minister that we have faint lines. I have wondered in the past whether the lines do not get tired out from all the talking. We are also dealing with overloaded farm-lines and poor connections. However, I want to say at once that the staff react so favourably and purposefully to our complaints that I would not for a moment accuse them of poor service. However, we should perhaps again see whether the material and the infrastructure still meet the existing needs.

I am very grateful that my colleague the hon member for Walmer gave attention to the matter of farm-lines, and I am pleased to hear of the progress with regard to possibly improved installations.

I also want to say a few words about the rural postal service. The rural postal service is getting worse. To give hon members an example, a voter in Hanover telephoned me and said the delivery of a letter from Colesburg to Hanover, which are neighbouring towns, took two weeks. Letters posted from Johannesburg to Hanover take two weeks to be delivered. [Interjections.] Letters posted from Empangeni to Hanover take two weeks to be delivered. They are sometimes important postal items. There are certain postal items that have deadlines and therefore have to be delivered at certain times. I am thinking, for example, of items posted to the Receiver of Revenue. He is, as hon members know, an impatient man. He does not easily understand reason if one says that the post was late. Our people do not always live near regional offices and are therefore obliged to make use of the postal services to have their mail delivered.

Then there are also the costs relating to the distribution of newspapers. I realise I am not exactly in the right field now, but because newspapers and magazines have traditionally been dealt with as postal items, I want to refer to them briefly. I know that we have had problems with this aspect since a new dispensation came into operation in the SATS on 1 January 1989. I appreciate the problem, but nevertheless as a representative of the rural areas and in the interests of my people I must ask that we do everything we can to ensure that the rural areas of South Africa do not fall further behind with regard to media services. The dissemination of information is essential. It is vital. It is also necessary, particularly in the rural areas, for our people to be provided with information on vital programmes such as the population development programme.

It is precisely in this area that we have the greatest problem, and specifically with the birth rate and social services. We must get the media to our people. This is important; let us take a newspaper such as Die Patriot of 3 March 1988.1 should like my people to read this Patriot because it contains information that they should know. It reads: “Hervorming stuur af op ’n Rooi Regering.” This is nonsense. I want my people to read this. They must see the rubbish they are being bombarded with from the members of the CP. [Interjections.]

Magazines, radio and television are services which are expensive for those of us in the rural areas. I appreciate this. I want to state the obverse too. It is precisely there in the rural areas, where our people have fewer other activities, that the provision of media information by means of posts and telecommunications services is of fundamental importance to our people. I know that if we look at the department’s budget for this year, we will see that R90,3 million has been appropriated for the transportation of mail. This is an increase of R31 million. Domestically this means an additional R30 million. For transport services it is R27 million; mail delivery vehicles R1,5 million. Estimated expenditure for private contracts was increased by more than R200 000. All of this should go to make up the R30 million. The figures indicate that positive steps are being planned to deal with the problem of mail distribution. The annual report of the department also addresses these problems. The department has introduced measures, since the mini-containerisation of postal items was introduced, ie co-ordination with SATS. I have a long list of new mail delivery vehicle routes put forward by the department to deal with this problem of improving mail distribution. However, there are still large areas in the rural areas of the Cape that are not covered by this.

I earnestly request Parliament to support the hon the Minister’s Appropriation. I take the liberty of asking the hon the Minister frankly to continue with the work of his department and to ensure that mail and postal items are delivered to a post box or an address with optimum speed throughout the country.

Mr Chairman, I should like to associate myself with all the congratulations and thanks already expressed here this afternoon.

It is an unfortunate fact that in the past, in this country, we have become poorer by the year. In due course we reached a stage of becoming poorer by the day. This Budget of the hon the Minister is making us poorer by the second. [Interjections.] I can hear interjections to the effect that this is not true, but every second one speaks on the telephone is now going to be more expensive, and that makes me poorer. [Interjections.]

The reasons for this can be attributed to several factors. It appears to me that, amongst other things, there is no form of communication between the various departments. This leads to frustration among the general public, which makes people despondent.

According to the De Villiers report the demand for telephones among Whites is now reaching saturation point. Let us consider what is happening now. Much of the demand is now from the residential areas of people of colour. Now that much of the demand is coming from these areas, the installation costs of telephones are about to be drastically increased. This should serve as a deterrent. Now that everyone else already has a telephone, and my people are to receive theirs, the availability levy is to be made so high that they will not be able to afford it. I find this unacceptable, and unfortunately I cannot support such a measure. [Interjections.] We can argue for days about this, but we shall simply have to face up to the truth.

I want to elaborate on what I mean when I say that there is no communication between the various Government departments. Whenever one department plans a residential area, it has become an established practice over the years for the Post Office to come along two or three years later and dig up the entire tarred road in order to lay a cable, after my taxpayers have paid dearly for the infrastructure. These things cost us money. We must work in a more co-ordinated manner.

According to statistics which I have available, there are 29 867 people employed at the Post Office who still earn less than R700 per month. If we advance the 15% salary increase as the reason for these tariff increases, then I ask with tears in my bright blue eyes—which I do not have—what these people were earning before the 15% increase. It is an injustice. When we qualify and look into this, we find that once again it is the person of colour who inevitably falls into this large group of people. I find this totally unacceptable.

We understand that the Appropriation also makes provision for various recreational facilities. Then we come to the great magic words that we use so easily, because we are becoming used to them, namely that these facilities are available to all Post Office employees—everyone in the department, regardless of race or colour. We are told that sometimes, amongst other things, snooker tables are even being bought for some of the remote and small post offices. Upon investigation, however, it transpires that this is not the case in practice. It is this type of thing which disturbs me.

I must be able to explain things to the public. Without either humiliating or protecting the hon the Minister, I want to be able to say in the first place in all honesty that the things we are told about are the things for which we are going to pay. Therefore we must be able to justify them.

Mr Chairman, in the time at my disposal it is a pleasure to thank the hon the Minister, the Postmaster-General and his top officials for their excellent service. What is more, and perhaps just as important, I should also like to thank officials in dusty little towns. In that respect I associate myself with the hon member for De Aar by expressing my particular appreciation to our postal and exchange staff. We in the Karoo who still have manual exchanges know what an exceptional service these people render. They know simply everything. They know much more about my daughter-in-law or about the dress my wife is going to buy than I do myself.

I should also like to thank the hon the Minister and his department for their contribution in respect of the philatelic services. This pertains to collectors of postage stamps. I should like to say something about that aspect today. Before I come to that, however, I want to address a single request to the hon the Minister on my own behalf and that of other rural constituencies in connection with the delivery, or lack thereof, of postal items and packages. I have already discussed this matter with the Postmaster-General, who has great understanding for and sympathy with my problem.

My request to the hon the Minister is that, after consultation with the hon the Minister of Transport Affairs, he will give a clear explanation on television of the reasons for the enormous delay in the delivery of postal items and packages. Rural MPs are constantly trying to explain to loyal voters why Die Burger is no longer delivered in time as it was in the past, and why the doctor now has to wait four days and longer for important medicine. I can carry on like this for hours. Really great discomfort is being experienced. Touws River, which is an hour and a half from Cape Town by road, now waits four days for a tin of yeast. I can give more and more examples, but I believe the hon the Minister has got the message.

I should now like to speak about the philatelic services, which the Post Office controls and handles with great distinction, ft is one of the smallest but most profitable sections of the Post Office, and is quite probably the only section of the postal service which is run in an ongoing and profitable way, with a separate profit and loss account since 1972. Should the postal service be privatised in the near future, the philatelic services will immediately be able to make an own profitable living as a business centre.

The Inter-Southern African Philatelic Association, or Intersapa, was established before Transkei became independent in order to operate and promote the philatelic services of the independent Black states. By means of well-planned promotion, which is still taking place constantly, these Black states were introduced to millions of postage stamp collectors throughout the world in a non-political way. This was done by placing advertisements in selected philatelic magazines and. where possible, by marketing their philatelic material with that of the RSA and South West Africa at international postage stamp exhibitions.

Unfortunately there is an international boycott in this sphere as well, and we are prevented from attending some of the largest shows. We do still have access to certain exhibitions, however. We should avail ourselves of every opportunity to make our and the TBVC countries’ philatelic presence felt there, since the themes that are presented on our stamps and those of the Intersapa countries should be regarded as small ambassadors which reach even to behind the Iron Curtain. The way of life, traditions and development in all spheres in the Intersapa countries are presented without any negative political connotations being attached.

Unlike most countries and world entities which issue postage stamps, we and the Intersapa countries follow an extremely conservative issuing policy. A maximum of five series of stamps is issued by each country every year. Usually there are four series of four stamps per year, which are so reasonably priced that any schoolchild can afford to buy the stamps with his or her own pocket money, in contrast with the great majority of countries which see how much money they can make out of collectors with the many expensive series of stamps that they issue almost without a break.

The popularity of our stamps resides not only in their reasonable purchase price; our stamps have been in demand over the years because of their outstanding designs and the exceptional quality of our Government Printer’s printing expertise.

As soon as the stamp programme has been approved for a particular year on Cabinet level, private artists throughout the country receive commissions which bind them by contract to render works of art to the department for a specific series of stamps. Previously there were certain artists who had a grounding in the miniature art of designing postage stamps, an art that sets its own norms and stringent requirements.

On commission artists are usually supplied with background material which has been researched by the staff of the Philatelic Services. At a given time their work is submitted and regarded critically. Changes are made where necessary before the work is submitted to the postage stamp advisory committee for critical examination and recommendation to the Minister-in-Council.

The Government Printer then commences with his laborious and precise procedures, such as separating the colours of the designs and taking photographs by means of the step-and-repeat camera, which reduces each design to postage stamp size and then reproduces the design repeatedly on photographic plates.

The Post Office realises that philatelists are an exceptional and appreciated group of clients who have an understanding of the highly educational value of philately which promotes family togetherness and co-operation and good relations with other collectors throughout the world. For this reason, and because the department wants to promote stamp collecting among young people as a healthy and instructive hobby, the Post Office gives the Philatelic Foundation of Southern Africa financial support that is budgeted annually. The main task of this foundation is the collection and spending of funds in order to promote philately.

Mr Chairman, I think the hon the Minister should be able to tell us today if this is the last Budget Speech for the Department of Posts and Telecommunications. I believe that the entire assets of this department will be transformed into a private company and that this company will then look after the interests of what is now held by the Post Office.

It would also be interesting to hear from the hon the Minister whether its board of directors will comprise members of all our communities and if Parliament will have a say in this.

It is also interesting to note that in this particular Budget the operating surplus was more than budgeted for. Therefore there is no point in asking for a tariff increase. Take for example the postage. It has been increased from 16 to 18 cents. I think the hon the Minister must be able to tell us whether there has been a decline in the mail that is handled by the Post Office. I have very good reasons to believe that there is a decline because each time the postage had been put up the various business communities have not given enough of their mail for the Post Office to handle. I know that there are many clearing houses run by private enterprise which handle private mail, parcels and packages at a very reduced rate. Only mail which is addressed to a post box is handled by the Post Office and wherever mail has a physical address it is handled by the clearing houses. The clearing houses handle mail at 5 cents an envelope. It is therefore not profitable to pay 18 cents to the Post Office. It will be interesting to hear whether the hon the Minister will tell us that there has been a decline in the handling of mail.

The other important point is whether the hon the Minister is able to tell Parliament that, he will now be able to reduce postage from 18 or 16 cents to 10 cents which will result in the Post Office having to handle a large volume of mail.

The other day I heard a postmaster complain about the nuisance of leaflets and pamphlets sent through the Post Office to various people by large firms, such as furniture dealers, to attract business. This has now been done away with. Some firms sent about 10 000 leaflets and pamphlets to various clients. Instead they now use the media— which is more effective—to print and publish these pamphlets. To send 10 000 letters or pamphlets at 18 cents each through the Post Office, amounts to something like R1 800. The Post Office, therefore, loses out on R1 800. I think that the tariff increases are due to the decline insofar as the mail is concerned.

There is also the question of the increase in the rental of telephones. It was pointed out that there would be a very high profit margin with the rentals imposed by the new tariff. In terms of the Group Areas Act various sprawling towns had been developed in order to resettle various communities. Telephones are no longer a luxury but an essential service. It is important to realise that it is not fair to call upon the very poor community to pay an additional increase in the tariff, notwithstanding the fact that they have to pay the very high municipal service charges and rental. I would, therefore, urge the hon the Minister not to make the increases which he proposes to do in this particular Budget.

There is also a very high charge insofar as the installation of telephones is concerned. I think the hon the Minister must be able to give hon members an explanation as to why he is now imposing a very high charge for the installation of telephones. Is it really necessary? The hon the Minister must take into account that he is going to charge and levy the very poor community by imposing this very big charge for a very important service insofar as the home is concerned. [Time expired.]

Mr Chairman, firstly I want to ask the hon the Minister, in his discussion of the Vote, to look into the introduction of an after-hours telephone repair service so that those persons and bodies that render essential services after hours—at night and over the week-ends— can have their telephones repaired immediately if the telephone is out of order, and so that they need not go without a telephone all week-end. In this connection one thinks for example of a doctor who is on call and for whom that service is therefore very, very important. One also thinks of those who render essential services, such as medical practitioners. In my opinion this kind of service is urgently required and the abuse of the service, which is of course possible, can be prevented by clearly defining the term “essential service’’. I should like to hear what the hon the Minister’s reply to this is.

†In the second place I want to refer to the plight of the aged or pensioners in our community. I am not the first to do so. For many of us in our modern day society the telephone, although essential, has become a curse to some extent. It is something that follows one wherever one goes. From a negative point of view the telephone has become the main violator of personal privacy and the greatest threat to those who try to get a few moments of privacy or peace to collect their thoughts. That only applies to those of us who are being chased by telephones, however.

However, to the aged—the pensioner—the telephone is indeed a close friend. It provides an essential service whereby the pensioner can maintain his links with the community, friends and family. To the aged a telephone is not a luxury. Their ability to do their own shopping or obtain medication, for example, is sharply reduced either because of a lack of own transport, a fear of today’s city traffic or the very real ever present threat of muggings resulting in permanent injuries.

The result is that the telephone becomes the pensioner’s means of ordering what is needed from the relative safety of his home. For the same reason the aged spend an ever-increasing amount of time on social calls—private calls—this being the only way in which a grandmother or grandfather can maintain voice contact on a daily basis with his or her grandchildren, family or friends.

Bearing in mind how the aged are burdened with meagre pensions—we should bear in mind that they only get R251 per month—failing eyesight, deteriorating health, a declining ability to walk far, a lack of personal transport and the unsuitability of public transport and the reality of a frequently lonely existence in a home or block of flats, it would in my opinion be nothing less than criminal for any government to add to this burden in such a way—as by increased tariffs—that the telephone becomes an unobtainable object to the pensioner.

If one looks at the present trend of price increases, especially the 20% increase in rental, and if one bears in mind the large chunk which the local metered call system will take from pensioners’ incomes, I believe that we are well on our way to making telephones a luxury for the aged and the poor.

My appeal to the hon the Minister today, in view of what I have said, is to accommodate the pensioner—to create a special dispensation for him. I suggest two steps: Firstly, that the telephone rental of all pensioners be reduced with immediate effect from the proposed R18 per month to a nominal R5. A similar reduction is already applicable with regard to telephone installation fees. Secondly, I want to ask him to investigate the possibility of not including pensioners’ telephones in the proposed local call metering system, if at all possible.

Not only I but thousands of pensioners both inside and outside my own constituency await the hon the Minister’s response with interest. We have had numerous calls from pensioners who feel that what is happening at the moment will make the telephone something they cannot afford.

Mr Chairman, the hon the Minister does not have to fear that I am going to ask him to resign as I did the hon the Minister of Transport Affairs. I think the hon the Minister of Transport Affairs can sit at ease in the House too because I will not ask him to resign today either.

During the debate on the additional estimates in this Chamber the other day, the hon the Minister reacted sharply to an interjection in which I said there is still discrimination in the Post Office. The headline in the Cape Times of Friday, 17 February 1989, states the following: “Stoffel denies PO ‘discrimination’”.

In the course of my speech I hope to point out to the hon the Minister that there is definitely still discrimination as I promised him when he said there was no discrimination. I will point out that there is definitely still discrimination within his department and that we cannot get away from it.

*Last year, in the debate on the Post Office Budget, the hon member for Carletonville asked in the White House for the Post Office Department to make telephones of various colours available for various races. [Interjections.] The hon member asked for the Whites to receive a white telephone … [Interjections] … and that the people of colour and the Blacks or nonWhites receive telephones of a different colour. He also said that the NP could receive grey telephones for their grey areas. The same hon member has now asked for all public telephones to be designated for use by Whites and nonWhites. [Interjections.]

If the hon member’s present seat in this Chamber is taken into consideration, he is definitely going to use a white telephone, because the system allows him to use it. However, when he goes out into the world outside, he has a problem. Then he does not really have a choice; he will have to use a black telephone.

It amazes me that the hon member is trying to take this country back into the past by wanting to affix discriminatory signs to telephones. I know the hon member has a problem. But he must not pass his problem on to the country. He must try to sort out his own problem or live with it. We are what we are. The other day I said in our House that he was an apple from the tree of the House of Representatives. All he must do is decide how far he has fallen. [Interjections.]

The hon the Minister knows that over the years the Post Office has been a body which has created work for the poorly qualified and the less affluent Whites. The Post Office also reserved 95% of its permanent services for Whites, and 95% of the temporary services for non-Whites. This created a situation in which the White man was the boss and the non-White was the “boy". This caused a problem. Probably the Minister also knows that there is a quota system in his department. I have no problems with a quota system, but if the quota system has an element of colour, I do have a problem. The hon the Minister must know that the quota system in his department has an element of colour.

The department reached an agreement with the White staff association to appoint only one person of colour for every five Whites in the technical section of the department. Unquestionably this is discrimination! Let us consider the large post offices such as those in Cape Town, Port Elizabeth, Durban, Johannesburg, Bloemfontein, Pretoria and Kimberley—all those major post offices are staffed primarily by Whites. There are people of colour too, but they are a drop in the ocean and are there only to perpetuate the window-dressing effort of the department. There is discrimination, too, in the administrative section of the department. There is a Coloured office post. This is undoubtedly discrimination, and I want the hon the Minister to give attention to it, because he said there was no discrimination.

In the workshops we can look into the position of panel-beaters, spray-painters, motor mechanics, builders, boiler makers, electricians, carpenters and plumbers. All of the workers in that division come solely from the White population group. That is also discrimination. Among the clerical posts, if there is not a racially-linked post, a person of colour is not going to get promotion either. The post of such a person must be termed “coloured”, followed by the post designation, otherwise he will never be promoted.

We can consider the postmasters. Recently the hon the Minister replied to a question I put to him in the House of Representatives. I asked him why there were no Coloured. Indian or Black postmasters in White areas.

†The hon the Minister’s reply to me was that such a person chooses to work in his own area. That is not an argument. He cannot use it as an argument. That person has not chosen to work in his own area, but the designation of his post states clearly that he is a “Coloured postmaster”. It does not say anything else and for that reason he will work in a “Coloured area”. Such a designation could also state “Indian postmaster”and “Black postmaster" Whatever his qualifications are, he will not be moved from there. He is not graded as a “White postmaster” as well.

We can look at the Post Office staff transport system as an example. The Whites are transported from place to place in a minibus and they sit comfortably. They have no problems. If the bus has 15 seats they will take 15 people. If it has 10 they will take 10, but what do the people do who are not White? They all have to ride in a lorry covered with a tarpaulin and they all have to sit in the back. All of them have to fit in there and they have to jump off at certain stops, while the Whites are either transported in a minibus or they have cars with which they can go home.

Yes, and who does the driving?

That is also discrimination. The hon the Minister must tell us today whether I was wrong that day in saying that there is discrimination within his department. He then said that I did not know what I was talking about.

The hon the Minister must also tell me how many postmasters, other than Whites, occupy the Grade 1 to Grade 4 posts. How many? My information shows that there are none. These postmasters can only work in certain areas that are allocated to them. They cannot operate in a White area. They have to remain where they are because of the colour of their skin. They did not ask to be a different colour. They did not ask to have a dark-coloured skin. Qualifications should matter, not the colour of one’s skin. That should be the last consideration. If we had to go through here and look at the colour of everyone’s skin a lot of people would be in trouble. Yes, a lot of people would be in trouble!

Let us look at the trucks that work for the Post Office daily. There is a qualified technician who sits in that truck. I am sure the department buys him the newspaper that he reads too! He sits in the truck and reads his newspaper. The people who are the ordinary labourers do his work but he is paid for it. There is no supervision. There is no-one to supervise him. A lot of the money that is supposed to be paid out for work done, is not. The person who is actually doing the work is not receiving the money. The person who is supposed to do the work sits and reads the newspaper.

The hon the Minister should exercise some form of control over his department. People drive around in the department’s vehicles. I see them in my constituency carting their families around, driving wherever they want to go. That is State money being wasted; money that comes from the taxpayers and from the user of the phone. He is the one who suffers and has to foot the bill. Every time there is an increase it is because there has been a loss elsewhere. The hon the Minister must definitely give attention to this.

I have so much more to say to the hon the Minister, but my time is up. However. I will send him a copy of this list I drew up of all the discriminatory things in his department.

Mr Chairman, as the last speaker in this debate, it is my privilege to make an important announcement for which the whole of South Africa is waiting with bated breath at the moment.

In Hoedspruit a village management board has been elected. Four of the six are now NP members after six CP members had been elected unopposed in the October elections last year. The person who gained the most votes, is the son of the hon member for Germiston District and our sincere congratulations to him. The results indicate a 15% swing back to the NP. [Interjections]

The hon member for Klipspruit West, like many other hon members, referred to the racial discrimination still present in this department. It is my task and responsibility, and I do so with pleasure, to state the policy regarding training in this department as well as possible. It is the task of this department to establish, maintain and improve channels of communication. At the same time this is however also the task of every South African who wants to build a new South Africa. One factor that can make a meaningful contribution to a reduction in conflict, is good communication. If the channels of communication in this country collapse, a bleak future lies in store for everyone in this country, whether we move to the desert or not. Even a tortoise requires a certain system of communication to survive in the desert.

If there is one charge that will serve against the bankrupt estate of the CP one day, it is that at a time when we needed one another, they not only tried to break down the channels of communication, but also tried to cast suspicion on it. I think we are all very much indebted to the friendly and competent Post Office personnel throughout the country who, with their efficient service, day after day invite every South African not to cease communicating with one another because the social reality in this country is, after all, built on communication. At the same time it is also reflected by good or bad communication. Adonien Maine stated this very clearly on page 325:

These realities have been built into the management policy of this department. In the first place this department looks after its people. Last year the hon member for Groote Schuur mentioned that 30 000 of the Post Office personnel, ie a third, fell into the lowest income group of R3 000 to R6 000 per year. This year it is significant that not one falls in this category and that the minimum wage of R375 per month has increased to R522 per month. It is also significant that 42% fall in the income category of R15 000 to R30 000 per month. This reflects a very good average.

We are all aware that this department has taken the lead in this country as regards the removal of apartheid partitioning, but it is less well known that tremendous progress has been made in this department in recent years. Regardless of what the hon member for Klipspruit West said—he is entitled to say so, because in that way we build a new South Africa—tremendous progress has been made regarding racial parity in salaries, conditions of service, benefits and especially training.

This department can justly boast that everyone receives the same training for the same work, that everyone progresses according to proven achievements on the basis of prescribed objectives and that all students—I repeat all students— are grouped together according to departmental requirements in order to achieve maximum utilisation of training facilities and personnel.

The only exception—and it is purely for functional reasons—is that the training centre at Soshanguve is used exclusively for the training of Black clerks. As a result of its excellent facilities and its strategic position, practically-speaking it is the right thing to do.

In the light of these general statements this department is rendering wide-ranging technical, clerical, administrative and mechanical training. National diplomas can be obtained in T or N courses in telecommunications. Academic selfqualification within the department is encouraged and properly compensated. A well-equipped training corps is continually offering everyone the chance to increase his knowledge and skill.

Today there are also opportunities for selected technicians to progress to technologists by means of further study. This department is proud that the first three people, who belong to groups other than the White group, recently obtained their Masters diploma in Technology.

This department makes maximum use of the most modern technology and it is used for the advancement of all the people of this country. Well-equipped personnel are also capable of coping with the present challenge of privatisation. The department can do this because it is already established on sound business principles. These are principles which are beautifully expressed by the founder of the international chain of stores, MacDonalds. Hon members would do well to take cognisance of his words:

The hon member for Klipspruit West aired his problems and we listened to them. He has every right to do this and he must not rest until his problems have been ironed out. [Interjections.] In our criticism we must, however, always remember that we can quarrel with one another in this country, but when we go out we must always remember:

South Africa has complex problems. In the words of the hon the leader of the LP, South Africa cannot be put right overnight. This country with its various communities does, however, have sufficient interests in common to create a good future for everyone—a good future in which good communication will play a decisive role.

Debate interrupted.

Mr Chairman, I move:

Agreed to.